Episode summary: Ed and I discuss his journey in and through sales and how the humbling moments can truly set us on a beautiful path if we allow them to.
Guest Name & Bio: Ed is a Podcast Advisor for Salescast.co and works with entrepreneurs and businesses all over the world to start and optimize their Podcast. Here’s what he has to say about himself…
“Life has taught me that it’s sometimes better to fold and wait for your next hand. I gave up my young aspirations of going into finance to pursue something with an immediate yield.
I fell into sales and it became my road to dignity. One that I wouldn’t change for anything! Going from a dependent to a provider at a young age was tough, but I was blessed to have my first real opportunity be the right one, at least for the time being.
When 2020 hit and I had to make a switch, it became less important what I was doing, and more importantly who I was doing it with. My mindset changed.
I am truly all about learning new things and meeting awesome people. I’m blessed to have the opportunity to do that on a daily basis. (While being 5000 miles away from some of them!!) My number one goal is to help drive ethical sales and humanize every business interaction we have.”
EPISODE TRANSCRIPTION
[Nick McGowan]: Ed, what’s up man i’m so excited you’re on the show how are you doing [Ed Purmalis]: add what’s up na I’m so excited to be on your show today good it’s been one of those crazy [Ed Purmalis]: days you know got my ass handed to me called calling today but you know [Nick McGowan]: oh [Ed Purmalis]: that’s just life [Nick McGowan]: oh man I think we should probably just [Nick McGowan]: jump right into that almost but give us a little bit of context here ed [Ed Purmalis]: right into that almost but give us a little bit of context here [Ed Purmalis]: so tell us one thing that you do for a living and something that most people [Nick McGowan]: so tell us one thing that you do for a living and something that most people don’t [Nick McGowan]: know about [Ed Purmalis]: okay so I work at SalesCast where we produce manage monetize people’s business [Ed Purmalis]: related podcasts and also get people booked on shows so anything to do with [Ed Purmalis]: podcasting you name it we do it [Nick McGowan]: doctor [Ed Purmalis]: and [Ed Purmalis]: i [Nick McGowan]: good [Ed Purmalis]: recently picked up the modern musical art of djing uh i [Nick McGowan]: nice [Ed Purmalis]: I was a big club goer in my early days and I’m a [Nick McGowan]: what [Ed Purmalis]: fan of different types of electronic music and one of the biggest things that you [Ed Purmalis]: learn and what you want to do as a dj it’s not about fame it’s not about cloud [Ed Purmalis]: it’s not about anything ’cause there’s a million people doing what you’re doing [Ed Purmalis]: there’s nothing proprietary about it you’re not creating something new but what it [Ed Purmalis]: is is a platform to share with people like hey this makes me feel good this is [Ed Purmalis]: going to make you feel good listen to it but you’re doing it on a grander stage so [Ed Purmalis]: It’s been a lot of fun [Nick McGowan]: oh man i get that [Ed Purmalis]: music [Nick McGowan]: I’m a musician so i [Nick McGowan]: totally understand that feeling and especially being able to share that back or [Ed Purmalis]: understand that feeling especially being able to share that back or you know kind [Nick McGowan]: you know just kind of be out in your own space in the flow state of that so how [Ed Purmalis]: of be out in your own space in the flow state of that so how did you get into dj [Nick McGowan]: did you get into djing was it through podcasts was it something completely [Ed Purmalis]: was it through podcast is it something completely different are you a music [Nick McGowan]: different are you a musician like give us a little bit of background [Ed Purmalis]: i’ll i’ll tell you this i was at an event quite a while back and one of my best [Ed Purmalis]: friends was playing there and you know if if you know the dj you get to walk [Ed Purmalis]: around the booth and you get kind of like vip access and all that and i was like [Ed Purmalis]: begging like mat put on this one song it’s gonna it’s gonna explode i’m telling [Ed Purmalis]: you he’s like now man when you learn how to use this that’s when you get to put on [Ed Purmalis]: your song in front of the crowd and i was like fuck okay you [Nick McGowan]: sure [Ed Purmalis]: got me so [Ed Purmalis]: some months later i just took the plunge bought a starter piece of equipment [Ed Purmalis]: That’s sitting right behind me and [Nick McGowan]: nice [Ed Purmalis]: just started from there that’s good stuff man so what about sales cats tell us a [Nick McGowan]: that’s good stuff man so what about sales cast tell us a bit like how how did you [Ed Purmalis]: bit like how did you get to sales gas and working in podcasting and what does that [Nick McGowan]: get to sales cast and working in podcasting and what does that look like what’s [Ed Purmalis]: look like [Nick McGowan]: your role there [Ed Purmalis]: oh wow so um i’ll i’ll start this off with the fact that i’ve been an avid podcast [Ed Purmalis]: listener since like the age of eleven or twelve so [Nick McGowan]: well [Ed Purmalis]: i i understand the medium very well there’s a four hour show that i listen to like [Ed Purmalis]: every single week ever since [Nick McGowan]: oh [Ed Purmalis]: Then and [Ed Purmalis]: it was a type of platform and media i really liked because it definitely had the [Ed Purmalis]: aspects of [Ed Purmalis]: um [Ed Purmalis]: the [Ed Purmalis]: the aspects of content creation that I’ve always admired in people but it doesn’t [Ed Purmalis]: require you to do videography it doesn’t require you to do this and that it just [Ed Purmalis]: requires you to have conversations and that’s something that I’ve always been keen [Ed Purmalis]: of something i’ve been fairly decent at so that was the dream right and as many [Ed Purmalis]: people in twenty twenty i lost my job and problem with my job was that it was a [Ed Purmalis]: sales job but it was one that didn’t bring a lot of transferable skills it was [Ed Purmalis]: very industry specific it was crazy it was b to c it was highly transactional and [Ed Purmalis]: it was very very focused on that particular industry [Ed Purmalis]: so i was out of luck i had just gone from a point of having of of you know making [Ed Purmalis]: bank at that age what i consider to be making bank to being jobless and not even [Ed Purmalis]: getting other sales positions that would literally cut my paycheck [Ed Purmalis]: five times like there was nothing out there for me so and that was the local [Ed Purmalis]: market for those who don’t know i am actually in europe i’m in regal avia so know [Ed Purmalis]: results may vary this is in the states we have a much different [Ed Purmalis]: sales ecosystem around here not a lot of companies that are working odd hours to [Ed Purmalis]: serve american clients which is what i was used to doing [Ed Purmalis]: so it was a difficult spot right so i decided hey if i can’t find a job here i’m [Ed Purmalis]: just going to kind of make my own jobs right i’m just going to find a company [Ed Purmalis]: that’s not here but that’s gonna be able to work with me remotely [Ed Purmalis]: and that’s ultimately going to be not even thinking about recruiting here so put [Ed Purmalis]: my skills to the test created a linkedin account started networking started going [Ed Purmalis]: through the motions joint slack communities did everything needed to network in a [Ed Purmalis]: time when everybody was stuck home and that’s how i met colin mitchell the ceo of [Ed Purmalis]: sales cast [Ed Purmalis]: awesome story so now at sales cast i know they do all things podcasts and this is [Nick McGowan]: an awesome story so now at sales cast i know they do all things podcast and this [Ed Purmalis]: in a commercial for sales cas but at the same time you’re welcome [Nick McGowan]: isn’t a commercial for sales cast but at the same time you’re welcome fellas [Ed Purmalis]: so [Nick McGowan]: so yeah i know you guys do a ton of stuff there i work with you guys as well so [Ed Purmalis]: yeah i know you guys do a ton of stuff there i work with you guys as well so tell [Ed Purmalis]: us a little bit of what the day to day looks like because this show is about your [Nick McGowan]: tell us a little bit of like what the day to day looks like because this show is [Nick McGowan]: about your mindset and how you right now it’s probably what midnight where you’re [Ed Purmalis]: mindset and how you right now it’s probably what midnight where you’re at yes all [Nick McGowan]: at right now [Ed Purmalis]: right um the day today honestly couldn’t be any better [Ed Purmalis]: And big part of that is the fact that [Ed Purmalis]: our management is probably the best management i’ve ever seen and this is coming [Ed Purmalis]: from somebody who’s worked in large scale thousand person sales team somebody [Ed Purmalis]: who’s worked in boutique recruitment agencies and someone who who’s a social [Ed Purmalis]: butterfly and gets to hear everybody else’s shitty work stories and how miserable [Ed Purmalis]: they are for me i li i live the night schedule i’ve been like that like ever since [Ed Purmalis]: i finished high school i was like i i just i just don’t wake up before noon it [Ed Purmalis]: just doesn’t happen [Ed Purmalis]: so all of that is pretty well covered the day to day is i wake up get to my [Ed Purmalis]: computer and just start going through the motions i don’t have a set schedule i [Ed Purmalis]: don’t have a set anything it’s just a full supportive system of me having access [Ed Purmalis]: to the people that need to have access to all the mentorship guiding and [Ed Purmalis]: everything else and help while simultaneously getting through a priority list of [Ed Purmalis]: things that i’m doing which would involve prospecting client meetings [Ed Purmalis]: content creation podcasting [Ed Purmalis]: linkedin [Ed Purmalis]: everything it has to do around the social b two b ecosystem [Ed Purmalis]: so let’s take a little bit of a step back so now here you are at podcast mania [Nick McGowan]: so let’s take a little bit of a step back so now here you are at podcast mania [Ed Purmalis]: with sales guest doing all the things podcast did she come from [Nick McGowan]: with sales cast doing all the things podcast but where did you come from [Ed Purmalis]: what was your starting point to be able to be where you’re at today and are there [Nick McGowan]: what was your starting point to be able to be where you’re at today and are there [Ed Purmalis]: any major points that really stand out like you know those are points that changed [Nick McGowan]: any major points that really stand out where you’re like you know those are points [Ed Purmalis]: you well [Nick McGowan]: that changed me throughout life [Ed Purmalis]: right so wait [Nick McGowan]: boy [Ed Purmalis]: are we doing career talk right now or are we doing just live talk in general [Nick McGowan]: we’re at this point [Ed Purmalis]: at this point i i’d say it’s really [Nick McGowan]: I’d say it’s really [Ed Purmalis]: It’s really [Nick McGowan]: it’s really all encompassing because your life and your career [Ed Purmalis]: to the point where you had said you wake up and you get to the computer like what [Nick McGowan]: even to the point where you had said you wake up and you get to the computer like [Nick McGowan]: what what does that look like when you actually jump right in cause i know there [Ed Purmalis]: what does that look like when you actually jump right in because i know there are [Ed Purmalis]: certain people and i think it was a mar uh mark at one point it said like i get up [Nick McGowan]: are certain people and i think it was even mark uh mark cuban at one point had [Nick McGowan]: said like i get up and just get right into my day and do my things and I’m not [Ed Purmalis]: and just get right into my day and do my things and I’m not sure how his mindset [Nick McGowan]: sure how his mindset is throughout the day if he gets super stressed or if he’s [Ed Purmalis]: is throughout the day if he gets super stressed or he’s got systems in place to be [Nick McGowan]: got systems in place to be able to do that but just trying to take a little bit [Ed Purmalis]: able to do that [Ed Purmalis]: okay [Nick McGowan]: of a step back to what did childhood look like to be able to kind of set you up to [Ed Purmalis]: be able to kind of set you up where you’re at today yeah so [Nick McGowan]: where you’re at today [Ed Purmalis]: interesting fact this is gonna be my underdog story i was not [Ed Purmalis]: a typical [Ed Purmalis]: high performing sales individual from birth you know companies nowadays don’t look [Ed Purmalis]: so much at your college degree when you’re going to sales roles they look more on [Ed Purmalis]: stuff like if you were an athlete or if you were like super hyper social and all [Ed Purmalis]: this other jazz which is like the stereotypical oh this is going to make a good [Ed Purmalis]: salesperson talk i was the most socially crippled awkward child you could ever [Ed Purmalis]: imagine i was the nerdiest guy in class i spent my whole childhood in front of a [Ed Purmalis]: computer which also bought a big but a boom right actually a good improvement [Ed Purmalis]: there because i was very comfortable sitting with a headset and talking with [Ed Purmalis]: people no anxiety there uh [Nick McGowan]: now here your [Ed Purmalis]: but but yeah i i i did not grow up to be a [Ed Purmalis]: to be molded into a salesperson by any means if anybody would have guessed through [Ed Purmalis]: my childhood they think i’d either be i don’t know making atomic bombs in my [Ed Purmalis]: basement or or or it to one of those two [Nick McGowan]: so if you’ve like ran into somebody from high school or even years ago and told [Ed Purmalis]: like ran into somebody from high school or even years ago and told them that [Nick McGowan]: them that you’re in sales they’d be shocked [Ed Purmalis]: you’re in sales a shot high school no high school was already more of a more of a [Ed Purmalis]: renaissance or social renaissance for me but people from [Nick McGowan]: okay [Ed Purmalis]: middle school and people from [Ed Purmalis]: elementary school and just just people who knew me as a child would be like what [Ed Purmalis]: the fuck [Nick McGowan]: sure [Ed Purmalis]: happened here [Nick McGowan]: oh man man [Ed Purmalis]: so i know you you said that you’ve been working with american companies for [Nick McGowan]: so i i know you you said that you’ve been working with american companies for [Nick McGowan]: quite some time and it sounded like that was kind of a [Ed Purmalis]: umhum [Nick McGowan]: preference like when you were deciding [Ed Purmalis]: i do next got to p execute the right people that you want to be able to work with [Nick McGowan]: on what i want to do next you got to pick the right people that you want to be [Nick McGowan]: able to work with i work with some people that are part of my teams that are in [Ed Purmalis]: I work with some people that are part of my teams that are in other countries as [Nick McGowan]: other countries as well and i often have wondered like what is it like for them to [Ed Purmalis]: well and i often have wondered like what is it like for them to be able to work [Nick McGowan]: be able to work with us because we get in our certain rhythms of things but what [Ed Purmalis]: with us because we get in our certain rhythms of things but what does that look [Nick McGowan]: does that look like throughout the day being able to manage that it’s basically [Ed Purmalis]: like throughout the day being able to manage that it’s basically midnight and [Nick McGowan]: midnight and being able to work through different kind of culturists things that [Ed Purmalis]: being able to work through different kind of culturists things that may be a bit [Nick McGowan]: may be a bit different than what you were used to [Ed Purmalis]: different than what you were used to [Ed Purmalis]: okay well [Ed Purmalis]: my story is in that sense is a bit more unique there’s a lot of outsourcing [Ed Purmalis]: happening simply because it’s a very good win win situation for a lot of people in [Ed Purmalis]: a lot of different continents they get paid more versus you know companies have to [Ed Purmalis]: pay less to get the same level of talent so there’s a whole integration process [Ed Purmalis]: there that often does or does not work out me i was raised on web one point zero [Ed Purmalis]: internet so internet forums video games raised on cartoon network raised on you [Ed Purmalis]: know american tv everything [Ed Purmalis]: every all the culture that I learned as a child who wasn’t very social was [Ed Purmalis]: american culture it was on the way you know you conversate the way you [Ed Purmalis]: present yourself everything about that i had learned from a very young age from [Ed Purmalis]: american media so that was definitely a big [Ed Purmalis]: a big advantage point in me honing my career in that way [Nick McGowan]: to [Ed Purmalis]: that you uh you were raised on cartoon network is awesome [Nick McGowan]: say that you you were raised on cartoon network is awesome just speaks directly to [Nick McGowan]: my heart about that stuff i often ask some people i’m like so [Ed Purmalis]: So did you watch [Nick McGowan]: did you watch ren and [Nick McGowan]: Stimpy as a kid and from that I can kind of tell like how life was for them as a [Ed Purmalis]: as a kid from that i can kind of tell [Nick McGowan]: child like yeah alright cool i watched it as well [Nick McGowan]: That’s interesting to hear that you grew up on that stuff too and that you know [Ed Purmalis]: you grew up on that too and that you know it’s not as much of a kind of a culture [Nick McGowan]: it’s not as much of a kind of a culture or shock i mean all the conversations that [Ed Purmalis]: shock i mean all the conversations that we’ve had just been a handful of them but [Nick McGowan]: we’ve had just been a handful of them but even with yourself with the rest of the [Ed Purmalis]: even with yourself the rest of the sales cast through uh it’s been awesome i mean [Nick McGowan]: sales cast crew it’s been awesome i mean you all kind of seem to be sort of [Ed Purmalis]: you and it seemed to be sort of similar in the sense [Nick McGowan]: similar in the sense [Ed Purmalis]: but let’s take a bit of a step let’s go back to your childhood and kind of how you [Ed Purmalis]: but let’s take a bit of a step let’s go back to your childhood and kind of how you [Nick McGowan]: but let’s take a bit of a step back let’s go back to your childhood and kind of [Nick McGowan]: how you got here you’d mentioned in the conversation we had before that there was [Ed Purmalis]: got dear you’d mentioned in the conversation we had before that there was kind of [Ed Purmalis]: got dear you’d mentioned in the conversation we had before that there was kind of [Nick McGowan]: kind of a big moment that really kind of changed things in life [Ed Purmalis]: a big moment that really kind of changed things in life [Ed Purmalis]: a big moment that really kind of changed things in life [Nick McGowan]: Do you [Nick McGowan]: want to kind of get into that big moment that happened when you were younger [Ed Purmalis]: You want to kind of get into that big moment that happened [Ed Purmalis]: yeah sure and just a backtrack to my [Ed Purmalis]: self claim of being a socially awkward and just flat out weird child it wasn’t i [Ed Purmalis]: wasn’t born that way really uh around the age of six i lost my father uh heart [Ed Purmalis]: attack at thirty eight free nar shit if you ask me [Nick McGowan]: wow [Nick McGowan]: yep [Ed Purmalis]: and [Ed Purmalis]: and [Ed Purmalis]: during that time period of the ages of six to around ten [Ed Purmalis]: we lost about six other close family members that were all kind of my replacement [Ed Purmalis]: dad in a sense you know uh [Nick McGowan]: hm [Ed Purmalis]: so there was a lot of like death and despair and depression around around my [Ed Purmalis]: family and just it was just basically and my mom who are still left at this day [Ed Purmalis]: so yeah i grew up very very damaged [Ed Purmalis]: um and [Ed Purmalis]: the only thing that we did have and what’s always been kind of an internal [Ed Purmalis]: motivator for me to succeed in sales [Ed Purmalis]: was that money was never an issue until maybe [Nick McGowan]: hey [Ed Purmalis]: I was like seventeen or eighteen so in that sense i was kind of i i grew up in a [Ed Purmalis]: you know fairly wealthy environment [Ed Purmalis]: but you know that all also came to an end and that’s you know that’s a story for [Ed Purmalis]: later in the show i guess [Nick McGowan]: that might be part two to what we’re talking about i mean that’s a lot man i i i [Ed Purmalis]: two to what we’re talking about yeah it’s a lot being i i couldn’t imagine not [Nick McGowan]: couldn’t imagine not having my dad now and man’s in his early sixty seconds at [Ed Purmalis]: having my dad now and man’s in his early sixty seconds at this point there were a [Nick McGowan]: this point there were a handful of years that we didn’t really talk [Ed Purmalis]: handful of years that we didn’t really talk [Nick McGowan]: but that that [Ed Purmalis]: but that [Nick McGowan]: was just a couple of years so i [Nick McGowan]: couldn’t imagine losing them at such a young age i would imagine though that does [Ed Purmalis]: a couple of years i couldn’t imagine [Nick McGowan]: something to [Ed Purmalis]: that does cost [Nick McGowan]: somebody especially a little boy [Ed Purmalis]: especially a little boy at that point [Nick McGowan]: at that point trying to grow up to be what is potentially a man without having [Ed Purmalis]: trying to grow up to be what is potentially a man without having that [Nick McGowan]: that [Nick McGowan]: that uh [Ed Purmalis]: that [Nick McGowan]: that person there to be [Ed Purmalis]: that person there to be able to help so what did that look like and how do you [Nick McGowan]: able to help so what does that look like and how do you think you actually not [Ed Purmalis]: think you actually not only found that yourself but do you think you had the [Nick McGowan]: only found that yourself but do you think you had the environment growing up that [Ed Purmalis]: environment growing up that was good to be able to help [Nick McGowan]: was good to be able to help you become the man that you are today [Ed Purmalis]: no really i’m i i’d say that i was mostly self raised my mom was [Nick McGowan]: okay [Ed Purmalis]: keeping down to fort making sure that everything is all right so i again grew up [Ed Purmalis]: on cartoons and the internet until a until pretty much high school [Ed Purmalis]: one of the biggest things you know since this is the mindset and self mastery show [Ed Purmalis]: one big reoccurring theme in my life has always been to try to hone out the toxic [Ed Purmalis]: behaviors in myself [Ed Purmalis]: and figure out where they’re coming from and figure out how to fix them and one of [Ed Purmalis]: the biggest realizations that i’ve come to given all the [Ed Purmalis]: death that I had in my family at a very young age is that i [Ed Purmalis]: especially when i entered the age of ha starting to have romantic relationships i [Ed Purmalis]: would have very very [Ed Purmalis]: superficial romantic relationships that’s how i would build them and that was [Ed Purmalis]: simply because you know in other people’s heads when they see people and [Ed Purmalis]: especially people that they love they associate somebody who’s going to be around [Ed Purmalis]: them forever when i see somebody that i love i’m used to life taking them away [Ed Purmalis]: from me so i would build very superficial very short term relationships that would [Ed Purmalis]: be insanely toxic and i would just be you know [Ed Purmalis]: i i would live with the kind of notion of you know fucking everybody dies what [Ed Purmalis]: does it matter if i hurt somebody or if i step on somebody’s toes or you know if i [Ed Purmalis]: just behavior with lily toxic and that was a theme in my life until maybe a year [Ed Purmalis]: ago [Ed Purmalis]: and it was something that i took time in the pandemic to really figure out and to [Ed Purmalis]: put an end to [Nick McGowan]: yeah there’s a lot of power and just being aware of it to be able to say that this [Ed Purmalis]: yeah a lot of power and just being aware of them to be able to say that this is [Nick McGowan]: is what this thing is now [Ed Purmalis]: what this thing is no no i assume in most cases because i know in mine it wasn’t a [Nick McGowan]: i assume in most cases because i know in mine it wasn’t a conscious decision to [Ed Purmalis]: conscious decision to look at things that way [Nick McGowan]: look at things that way but you just make these rationality and these thoughts of [Nick McGowan]: like well you know fuck it [Ed Purmalis]: umhum [Nick McGowan]: like you said they’re all gonna die anyway so why and then that just seeps in [Ed Purmalis]: they’re all gonna die anyway so walk then that just seeps in sometimes it’s really [Nick McGowan]: sometimes it’s really difficult to get that back out so what got you out of that [Ed Purmalis]: difficult to get that back out so what got you out of [Ed Purmalis]: well i i of moved that when i moved out of high school and into my first job i was [Ed Purmalis]: kind of thrown into the big boy life in a sense at the age of nineteen started [Ed Purmalis]: earning good money started you know living all the crazy shit that a nineteen [Ed Purmalis]: twenty twenty one year old would do when they’re high earning and they have [Ed Purmalis]: anxiety and they need to prove themselves to the world and you know they’ve [Ed Purmalis]: suddenly become the social butterfly and now they need to do all this crazy shit [Ed Purmalis]: the mentality there is that you know you’re stuck at nineteen [Ed Purmalis]: like that nineteen year old if you’re if you’re grinding two four seven in a sales [Ed Purmalis]: job it’s spending your weekends in nightclubs parties and i don’t know hooking up [Ed Purmalis]: with random people you’re you’re stuck you’re stuck there there is no emotional [Ed Purmalis]: growth or maturity that happens during that time frame because you’re just living [Ed Purmalis]: in a circle you’re just living you think that you have life figured out and [Ed Purmalis]: there’s no reason for you to make any adjustments or changes you’re freaking [Ed Purmalis]: perfect you’re doing great right [Ed Purmalis]: and [Ed Purmalis]: having to again lose everything lose my job lose my you know lose my lo lose [Ed Purmalis]: everything that i had put as my core values at the time the things that [Nick McGowan]: he said [Ed Purmalis]: took that little insecure child and made him big made him important all of those [Ed Purmalis]: things were suddenly gone again only this time i was not ready to rely on that [Ed Purmalis]: being my whole personality [Nick McGowan]: bringing up core values that’s that’s huge i i think the principal censored life [Ed Purmalis]: bringing up core values that’s that’s huge i think the principal centered life of [Nick McGowan]: of people if there’s no principles then you’re just meandering around and it [Ed Purmalis]: people if there’s no principle and you’re just hindering around and it sounds like [Nick McGowan]: sounds like you’re principal censored as well [Ed Purmalis]: your principal sensors as well [Nick McGowan]: what did that look like for you to be [Ed Purmalis]: what did that look like for you to be able to transform that was that something [Nick McGowan]: able to transform that was that something where you actually sat down and you’re [Ed Purmalis]: where you actually sat down and you’re like what is it that matters what at the [Nick McGowan]: like what is it that matters what at the core actually matters to me or did you [Ed Purmalis]: core actually matters to me or did you find it kind of bubbling up where you’re [Nick McGowan]: find it kind of bubbling up where you’re like oh i realize that this thing [Ed Purmalis]: like oh i realize that this thing actually matters [Nick McGowan]: actually matters and kind of setting that aside [Ed Purmalis]: I’d say more more of the first it was it was seeing uh what changes in my life [Ed Purmalis]: When I don’t have all these things that I had said as my sort of value proposition [Ed Purmalis]: for my personality [Ed Purmalis]: which people react in which ways what is really important who are the ones who [Ed Purmalis]: stick around who are the ones who leave what kind of attitude changes happen et [Ed Purmalis]: cetera when i had time to analyze what’s going around me and to [Ed Purmalis]: for the first time feel support without having to [Ed Purmalis]: justify it in my mind without having to think to myself they’re just you know [Ed Purmalis]: doing it cause i’m freaking awesome and king of everything [Ed Purmalis]: seeing that kind of support [Ed Purmalis]: made me really think about myself and my own behaviors and all the times i had not [Ed Purmalis]: been that person all the times i had been you know toxic just just just just i’ll [Ed Purmalis]: be brutally honest just being toxic it was it was a it was a crazy time and coming [Ed Purmalis]: to those realizations and seeing those situations through dude i’ve written [Ed Purmalis]: apology letters I’ve contacted [Nick McGowan]: hey [Ed Purmalis]: people that i hadn’t talked to in years i went through a whole [Ed Purmalis]: I went through a whole crusade of trying to make things right and deciding to be a [Ed Purmalis]: better person from there [Nick McGowan]: Do you think you were trying to make [Nick McGowan]: things right for yourself or to just have the [Ed Purmalis]: you were trying to make things right for yourself or [Nick McGowan]: face of it that you did it that you made things right [Ed Purmalis]: to just have the face of it i i [Ed Purmalis]: you know i i’ve been having this debate in my head plenty but i’ll tell you what [Ed Purmalis]: it wasn’t a it wasn’t a relieving or even a [Ed Purmalis]: process that i enjoyed at that point in time i just know it it was something that [Ed Purmalis]: had to be done [Ed Purmalis]: ah it took me you know i had to put my pride aside which listen if you take [Ed Purmalis]: somebody who’s super insecure and then they achieve things in life what happens is [Ed Purmalis]: that they can often go [Ed Purmalis]: way in the other spectrum and that’s what had happened to me i had went from [Ed Purmalis]: somebody who was super insecure to an ego monster [Ed Purmalis]: and [Nick McGowan]: hm [Ed Purmalis]: you take an ego monster ap of everything that guards him and then he has to go and [Ed Purmalis]: apologize to people it’s not a process that you enjoy at first but it’s something [Ed Purmalis]: that afterwards makes you think you know i know i didn’t write my wrongs in any [Ed Purmalis]: way shape or form but i do realize that you know i at this point knowing what [Ed Purmalis]: what’s done is done i’ve done the best possible [Ed Purmalis]: future move that i could have ever made for those people i’m for myself [Nick McGowan]: yeah makes sense and [Ed Purmalis]: makes sense and thank you for naming the episode i think we have to go with e [Nick McGowan]: thank you for naming the episode i think we have to go with ego monster or [Nick McGowan]: something of the like at this point it’s well done [Ed Purmalis]: sure [Nick McGowan]: the ego monster so [Ed Purmalis]: the ego monster so [Nick McGowan]: I think jumping from [Nick McGowan]: the opposite side of the ego monster is somebody who is maybe completely docile [Ed Purmalis]: I think jumping from the opposite side of the ego monster to somebody who is maybe [Ed Purmalis]: completely dusted just allows people to walk all over them how [Nick McGowan]: just allows people to walk all over them how are you finding balance right now [Ed Purmalis]: right now [Ed Purmalis]: yeah that’s i’m very happy that you brought that up because there were definitely [Ed Purmalis]: points after i dropped the whole uh i after i dropped the narcissism thing and uh [Ed Purmalis]: started becoming a better person where you know some people didn’t get with the [Ed Purmalis]: times and they and and you know there was that [Ed Purmalis]: that imbalance of people trying to step on my head a little bit and even and even [Ed Purmalis]: during that time i was i was in a relationship during the time of my fall or [Ed Purmalis]: whatever you want to call it and even there it was the exact same thing like [Nick McGowan]: cool [Ed Purmalis]: that person was starting to step on me and all of a sudden i realized that the [Ed Purmalis]: whole thing is toxic and i ended it because you know it was i i realized it was [Ed Purmalis]: toxic because [Ed Purmalis]: i lost my train of thought there i think you might need to do that editing thing [Ed Purmalis]: here [Nick McGowan]: you’re totally good so you were talking about how you ended your relationship [Nick McGowan]: because it was toxic [Ed Purmalis]: relationship [Nick McGowan]: because people were walking on you [Ed Purmalis]: because people were walking on you on the [Nick McGowan]: you were on the opposite side of being the ego monster you were being walked on at [Ed Purmalis]: yeah yeah i’ll all those yeah i all of a sudden i went from you know [Nick McGowan]: that point [Ed Purmalis]: From what I thought at the time was one hundred down all the way to a zero and was [Ed Purmalis]: trying to rein myself and he and the person that i was with was starting to was [Ed Purmalis]: starting to i guess not appreciate this new personality of mine [Ed Purmalis]: because you know i mean people fall in love with people for different reasons and [Ed Purmalis]: the person that she was in love with was that you know ego monster was that was [Ed Purmalis]: that guy and that was fine with me i decided to end right right there and there [Ed Purmalis]: because i don’t expect anybody to put up with you if your personality takes a one [Ed Purmalis]: hundred eighty over the sense of six seven months right like that that’s the [Ed Purmalis]: reason why a lot of divorces happen in my opinion is because people change so much [Ed Purmalis]: during that time that you no longer recognize the person that you’re with and in [Ed Purmalis]: this case i was that person who was no longer recognizable so i had to make my [Ed Purmalis]: adjustments make my changes and [Ed Purmalis]: go go back to the drawing board [Nick McGowan]: It’s a constant [Nick McGowan]: evolution man so even with that the relationship side of things they are [Ed Purmalis]: it’s a constant evolution man [Ed Purmalis]: even with that the relationship side of things there are definitely people that [Nick McGowan]: definitely people that have those problems i think from a relationship perspective [Ed Purmalis]: have those problems i think from a relationship perspective you’ve got to be able [Nick McGowan]: you’ve got to be able to continue to grow on your own so being able to grow on [Ed Purmalis]: to continue to grow on your own so being able to grow on your own and allowing [Nick McGowan]: your own and allowing others to be able to grow as well i think we’re there to do [Ed Purmalis]: others to be able to grow as well i think we’re there to do life with people be it [Nick McGowan]: life with people be at an intimate relationship or even friendships you know [Ed Purmalis]: an intimate relationship or even french you know you’ve got a love and support [Nick McGowan]: You’ve got to love and support those people [Ed Purmalis]: those people [Nick McGowan]: not exactly similarly but in certain ways to be able to be there for them and kind [Ed Purmalis]: not exactly similarly but in certain ways to be able to be there for them kind of [Nick McGowan]: of encourage and all of that so it sounded like you were doing more of that for [Ed Purmalis]: encourage and all of that so it sounded like you were doing more of that for [Nick McGowan]: yourself and if that person was [Ed Purmalis]: yourself and if that person was [Nick McGowan]: not along the same [Nick McGowan]: lines or growing in the same way that’s totally all right not only does that [Ed Purmalis]: not along the same lines they’re growing in the same way that’s totally all right [Nick McGowan]: happen but that’s a better choice for you to know like that’s not what i want to [Ed Purmalis]: not only does that happen but that’s a better choice for you to know like that’s [Nick McGowan]: be a part of anymore so it’s huge to be able to do that it’s interesting how [Ed Purmalis]: not what i want to be a part of me you should be able to do that it’s interesting [Nick McGowan]: people go through seasons where like like you said you realize [Ed Purmalis]: how people go through seasons where [Nick McGowan]: a cycle and you’re like we’ve been doing the same forever and ever and then that [Ed Purmalis]: like you said you realize a cycle like you doing say shit forever [Nick McGowan]: fall that [Nick McGowan]: splat moment that happens and you go well what do i want to do now actually needs [Ed Purmalis]: and then the fall that flat moment that happens and you go well fuck what do i [Ed Purmalis]: want to do now what actually needs to happen people get stuck there and they just [Nick McGowan]: to happen some people get stuck there and they just live there so the balance [Ed Purmalis]: live there so the balance within yourself now and not being the ego monster not [Nick McGowan]: within yourself now and not being the ego monster not letting people walk all over [Ed Purmalis]: letting people walk all over you how do you do that throughout each day like what [Nick McGowan]: you how do you do that throughout each day like what are the things that you do to [Nick McGowan]: be able to keep yourself on that straight narrow in a sense [Ed Purmalis]: do you think you do to be [Ed Purmalis]: umhum um i i i think you know if we’re going to put it on a scale you never want [Ed Purmalis]: to be you never want to be a zero and you never want to be a ten you never want to [Ed Purmalis]: be on either [Nick McGowan]: yeah [Ed Purmalis]: side of the spectrum in both those things well you have to understand that you [Ed Purmalis]: know life and situations and people in general are going to have peaks and valleys [Ed Purmalis]: and it is okay for you to scale to one side or the other on occasion due to [Ed Purmalis]: reasons of you know to to any reason whatsoever but it’s all about figuring out [Ed Purmalis]: you know at which point you need to stop and at which point do you need to move [Ed Purmalis]: between one or the other because you’re never going to be a straight arrow you’re [Ed Purmalis]: never going to be the same guy or the same girl every single day that’s just not [Ed Purmalis]: how it works there’s too many variables to life to [Ed Purmalis]: be consistent [Ed Purmalis]: a hundred percent of the time [Ed Purmalis]: so for me i guess the biggest lesson was to go through being both aspects and [Ed Purmalis]: having to almost do it twice because you know when i was a kid i was a complete [Ed Purmalis]: doormat when i became a young adult i was exactly the opposite so i had i had a [Ed Purmalis]: full range of both of these things happening in my life for extended periods of [Ed Purmalis]: time where i could identify okay this is let’s just say fun behavior this is toxic [Ed Purmalis]: behavior what’s the difference the difference is toxic behavior people get hurt in [Ed Purmalis]: fun behavior everybody’s having fun [Ed Purmalis]: and [Nick McGowan]: h [Ed Purmalis]: it’s it it’s i’d say that my biggest [Ed Purmalis]: uh my biggest anti toxicity cure for myself [Ed Purmalis]: has been to finally be honest with people about my role my intentions and [Ed Purmalis]: everything else cause [Ed Purmalis]: that that that’s the only way you can keep it in check it’s by being honest with [Nick McGowan]: hm [Ed Purmalis]: yourself and by being honest with others because [Ed Purmalis]: you know neither being a doormat nor being an ego monster is anybody’s natural [Ed Purmalis]: state you’re being [Nick McGowan]: yeah [Ed Purmalis]: dishonest and you’re putting on a show and there’s a reason why you’re doing it so [Ed Purmalis]: look in the mirror and figure out why that is what triggers it and how to find [Ed Purmalis]: balance between either or [Nick McGowan]: man that’s a lesson [Ed Purmalis]: man that’s a lesson for everybody [Nick McGowan]: for everybody but specifically [Nick McGowan]: salespeople think about the amount of salespeople that turned into [Ed Purmalis]: specifically sales [Ed Purmalis]: that turn it to somebody [Nick McGowan]: somebody else like they pick up a phone they’re like [Nick McGowan]: hello thank you for calling blah blah blah you’re like who the is that [Ed Purmalis]: i’m like hello calling blah blah blah [Ed Purmalis]: go ahead [Nick McGowan]: guy that makes no sense and they’re just somebody different you got to be you you [Ed Purmalis]: no sense and there’s just somebody different you gotta be you you got to be [Nick McGowan]: got to be authentic and you got to know and feel in your own skin and be able to [Ed Purmalis]: authentic and you got to know and feel in your own skin and be able to actually [Nick McGowan]: actually say like this doesn’t line up and here’s why and i think it’s setting [Ed Purmalis]: say like this doesn’t line up and here’s why i think it’s setting expectations [Nick McGowan]: expectations which goes back to the relationship and the relationship with [Ed Purmalis]: which goes back to the relationship and the relationship with yourself being able [Nick McGowan]: yourself and being able to set those expectations or these are the things that i [Ed Purmalis]: to set those expectations these are the things that i do these are things i don’t [Nick McGowan]: do these are the things i don’t do just like in sales being able to these are the [Ed Purmalis]: just like in sales being able to these are the things i do these things i don’t [Nick McGowan]: things i do and these are the things i don’t do [Nick McGowan]: You’d mention that you kind of got your ass handed to you with a cold call do you [Ed Purmalis]: uh you’d mentioned that you kind of got your ass handed to you with a call call if [Nick McGowan]: want to jump into that uh why you think you got your ass handed to you like what [Ed Purmalis]: you want to jump into that uh why you think you got your ass no no no like you [Nick McGowan]: happened that’s probably [Ed Purmalis]: know call calling is [Ed Purmalis]: if called calling isn’t a humbling process [Nick McGowan]: oh [Ed Purmalis]: then you’re not doing enough of it [Ed Purmalis]: and if you’re ever blocking out time and actually doing it you’re going to come to [Ed Purmalis]: a realization that a lot of people won’t talk to you a lot of people won’t need [Ed Purmalis]: what you’re providing and some people you just gonna have a shitty day and they’re [Ed Purmalis]: gonna let it out on you but [Nick McGowan]: good [Ed Purmalis]: That’s another part of you know [Ed Purmalis]: cold calling is one of those things that i think helps people keep their ego in [Ed Purmalis]: check but also you know i think i think anybody who’s going into the workforce [Ed Purmalis]: should at least cold call for a couple of months and see what it’s like because [Ed Purmalis]: It’s gonna be [Nick McGowan]: yeah [Ed Purmalis]: a humbling experience but it’s also gonna be something that’s going to show you [Ed Purmalis]: your ability to find the right people and to form connections out of nowhere and [Ed Purmalis]: that is an [Ed Purmalis]: insane life skill to have insane [Nick McGowan]: see [Ed Purmalis]: if you can do that you can do anything in my opinion [Nick McGowan]: so if you think you go from the cold call you get into the meeting even if those [Ed Purmalis]: so if you think you go from the cold call you get into the meeting even if those [Nick McGowan]: people that actually [Ed Purmalis]: people that actually [Nick McGowan]: set the meeting i realize that there are people that can set a meeting but they [Ed Purmalis]: set the meeting to realize that there are people that can set a meeting but they [Nick McGowan]: can’t handle the meeting they can’t close a meeting at that point that’s a whole [Ed Purmalis]: can’t handle it they can’t close at that point that’s a whole different and being [Nick McGowan]: different animal and being able to manage again it’s later and i keep thinking [Ed Purmalis]: able to manage again it’s later and i keep thinking like god if i was trying to [Nick McGowan]: like god if i was trying to make co calls at midnight iss answering that call [Ed Purmalis]: make cold calls at midnight some dancing that call midnight they’d be pissed right [Nick McGowan]: midnight they’d be pissed right off the bat like what [Ed Purmalis]: off the bath [Nick McGowan]: but going through and talking [Nick McGowan]: to these people when you go through and work with them and have somebody that’s [Ed Purmalis]: but going through and talking to these people when you go through and and work [Ed Purmalis]: with them and have somebody that’s interested what’s the process kind of take them [Nick McGowan]: interested what’s the process that you kind of take them through ’cause what i’m [Ed Purmalis]: through [Nick McGowan]: assuming you’re all [Ed Purmalis]: what i’m assuming [Nick McGowan]: podcast hosts right [Ed Purmalis]: no not always i mean it’s potential podcast host b two b brands that might be [Ed Purmalis]: looking into podcasting there’s a couple different [Ed Purmalis]: we’re very industry agnostic and we don’t have a clearly defined icp at this point [Ed Purmalis]: it’s just people who want to do something with podcasts really [Nick McGowan]: gotcha [Ed Purmalis]: so [Ed Purmalis]: the the process is fairly simple you talk through it with people and instead of [Ed Purmalis]: trying to sell them something you talk through a potential business case on how [Ed Purmalis]: that could or could not help them and [Ed Purmalis]: From there it’s [Ed Purmalis]: ninety nine percent at a time either both of you are going to agree that it’s a [Ed Purmalis]: good idea or both of you are not going to agree that it’s a good idea it just [Ed Purmalis]: really depends on how thorough you are with your discovery process [Ed Purmalis]: and if you’re actually willing to be honest with people from the get go taking [Ed Purmalis]: yourself out of the equation and instead of thinking of it as selling something [Ed Purmalis]: to someone [Ed Purmalis]: you’re thinking about it as a collaborative effort to figure out if this is [Ed Purmalis]: something that they might need and if you are the best equipped person to help [Ed Purmalis]: them with that i feel like that type of sales ideology and that type of sales [Ed Purmalis]: process is first of all the place where the sales environment is moving and i’m [Nick McGowan]: hmm [Ed Purmalis]: super happy for it that’s that’s [Nick McGowan]: yeah thank god [Ed Purmalis]: what feels natural and right to me that’s how i was born and raised you know um [Ed Purmalis]: and i think that’s pretty much it i mean that that pretty much says it all [Nick McGowan]: yeah i agree [Nick McGowan]: that it’s everything’s headed toward more [Ed Purmalis]: yeah i agree that it’s [Nick McGowan]: authenticity and conversations and being able to figure out how do we have a win [Ed Purmalis]: more authenticity and conversations and being able to figure out how do we have a [Nick McGowan]: win i mean honestly the amount of times i even said that today within partnership [Ed Purmalis]: win win you know honestly the amount of time they even said that today with [Ed Purmalis]: different partnership calls like all product fas today just being able to figure [Nick McGowan]: calls and client calls and prospects calls today just being able to figure out the [Nick McGowan]: win win how do we solve the problems here and actually help the win win and i [Ed Purmalis]: out the win win how we solve the problems here and actually help them win in and i [Nick McGowan]: think that starts with us man you know being able to have our shit together and [Ed Purmalis]: think that starts with us and you know being able to have our shit together and [Nick McGowan]: figure out because think about it anybody who’s listening to this that’s a [Ed Purmalis]: figure out about it anybody who’s listening to this that’s a salesperson that has [Nick McGowan]: salesperson that has ever made a cold call the day after drinking way too much you [Ed Purmalis]: ever made a cold fall the day after drinking way too much [Nick McGowan]: know your head’s not in it you’re just not all there [Ed Purmalis]: you’re not all there [Nick McGowan]: and you’re like fighting through the fog even [Ed Purmalis]: through the fog even [Nick McGowan]: so [Ed Purmalis]: So when a lot of people actually fight through a dense fog just every single day [Nick McGowan]: when a lot of people actually fight through a dense fog just every single day so [Nick McGowan]: how do you manage your mindset throughout the day cold calls meetings just all the [Ed Purmalis]: So how do you manage your mindset throughout the day co calls meetings just all [Nick McGowan]: things that go along with it but how do you keep yourself kind of motivated what [Ed Purmalis]: the things that go along with it but how do you keep yourself kind of motivated [Nick McGowan]: are the tips and tricks you’d give other people the that are going through the [Ed Purmalis]: and what are the tips and tricks you’d give other [Nick McGowan]: same stuff [Ed Purmalis]: this is gonna be super cheesy but it’s something that i realize is the truth it’s [Ed Purmalis]: going to be a much easier process as long as you truly believe that you guys are [Ed Purmalis]: doing something great and you truly believe in the product and there’s a level of [Ed Purmalis]: passion that goes with what you are providing and what you’re selling and what [Ed Purmalis]: you’re preaching if you are somebody who is selling fishing rods but fucking hates [Ed Purmalis]: boats you’re you’re not you’re you’re you’re not [Nick McGowan]: get out [Ed Purmalis]: in the right position [Nick McGowan]: yeah [Ed Purmalis]: get out exactly [Ed Purmalis]: for me it’s [Ed Purmalis]: and this is actually a struggle area for me i’m not even going to go here and say [Ed Purmalis]: that i am the most productive or most always motivated person in the world my [Ed Purmalis]: strongest motivator in those moments when you don’t feel like doing things is [Ed Purmalis]: seeing the work [Ed Purmalis]: and the love that’s been put into me and the company itself by our c suite by our [Ed Purmalis]: co founders seeing their level of work and dedication and the level of help and [Ed Purmalis]: support i get is the one thing that that has taken me to the next level there and [Ed Purmalis]: that’s not something that you can just [Ed Purmalis]: figure out that you have at this point but it is definitely something that anybody [Ed Purmalis]: should look into if they don’t feel like that’s what they’re receiving now you [Ed Purmalis]: know people like to say that you know sales people are [Ed Purmalis]: coin slot operated you know and that to an extent is true i i i’ve i’ve i’ve i’ve [Ed Purmalis]: I’ve lived a rich life and I lived a poor life and you know i ch i’d choose rich [Ed Purmalis]: life any day of the week right [Ed Purmalis]: it’s you know there there is a level of truth to that but then again i wouldn’t go [Ed Purmalis]: and do it in finance i wouldn’t go and do it in [Ed Purmalis]: pretty much any other area because it does not involve the one thing that i guess [Ed Purmalis]: I’ve always been [Ed Purmalis]: yearning from childhood which is to have legitimate sincere human connections so i [Ed Purmalis]: guess i i i guess that’s what ties back to my mental state and maybe gives a [Ed Purmalis]: better background of what i’m thinking about the whole ordeal [Nick McGowan]: I love how you [Nick McGowan]: almost seem really grateful like if we had to nail it down to one word it almost [Ed Purmalis]: I love that you almost seem really grateful we had the nail down the one where it [Nick McGowan]: sounds like it’s just grateful and um [Ed Purmalis]: themselves and just break [Ed Purmalis]: and um [Nick McGowan]: appreciative and respectful even [Ed Purmalis]: appreciative and respectful [Nick McGowan]: thank you [Ed Purmalis]: like thank you to help i think everything rises in false leadership so think about [Nick McGowan]: to help i think everything rises and falls with leadership so think about it if [Nick McGowan]: people at the top of whatever company be it if you own your own company and you’re [Ed Purmalis]: it people at the top of whatever company [Ed Purmalis]: if you own your own company and you’re at the top where you work for a company and [Nick McGowan]: at the top or if you work for a company and they’re giant or tiny or whatever the [Ed Purmalis]: they’re giant or tiny or whatever the people at the top are shitty people t [Nick McGowan]: people at the top are shitty people typically the people they hire and typically [Ed Purmalis]: typically the people they hire and typically the people that stay around [Nick McGowan]: the people that stay around [Nick McGowan]: they have some [Nick McGowan]: shitty isms to e and we don’t want to have that you know so the fact that you guys [Ed Purmalis]: they have some shitty ism still [Ed Purmalis]: you don’t want to have that you know so the fact that you guys actually have [Nick McGowan]: actually have people that care and um [Ed Purmalis]: people that care and [Nick McGowan]: the dig in they’re [Ed Purmalis]: dig in they’re literally in the trenches working through this stuff that’s huge [Nick McGowan]: literally in the trenches working through this stuff that’s huge and that’s a huge [Ed Purmalis]: and that’s a huge testament to everybody else that’s working for the business as [Nick McGowan]: testament to everybody else that’s working in the business as well i think a lot [Ed Purmalis]: well i think a lot of people can kind of take from that where it seems like that’s [Nick McGowan]: of people can kind of take from that where it seems like that’s a core principle [Ed Purmalis]: a core principle for people you work with and i love that about different leaders [Nick McGowan]: to the people you work with and i love that about different leaders that i come [Nick McGowan]: across where you can just tell like i know that outside of work you’re probably a [Ed Purmalis]: that i come across you can just tell like i know that outside were [Nick McGowan]: great dad or at least you try you know like you try to do it and you’re probably a [Ed Purmalis]: you’re probably a great da or at least you try you know like you try to do you’re [Nick McGowan]: really good friend or at least you’re really frig and try you know what i mean so [Ed Purmalis]: probably a really good friend or at least you’re really frig and try you know what [Nick McGowan]: i i enjoy when people actually take it to those extents and that you can see that [Ed Purmalis]: i mean i i enjoy when people actually take it to those extents and that you can [Nick McGowan]: and kind of rock and roll with it and it gives you more power to be able to [Ed Purmalis]: see that you kind of rock and roll with it it gives you more power to be able to [Nick McGowan]: actually do what you do um do you think that that’s something that [Ed Purmalis]: actually do what you do um do you think that that’s something that [Nick McGowan]: people can [Ed Purmalis]: people can [Nick McGowan]: kind of [Ed Purmalis]: kind of [Nick McGowan]: promote through their own [Ed Purmalis]: promote through their own companies that they work in [Nick McGowan]: companies that they work in or is it just a mental state that they gotta get to [Ed Purmalis]: oh i love this topic nick let’s go [Ed Purmalis]: see i i’ve i’ve i’ve read and talked and lived through this topic in my life to [Ed Purmalis]: give you a bit of a background of you know the whole environment that nurtured [Ed Purmalis]: this you know crazy ego monster personality that i used to have is my first real [Ed Purmalis]: workplace where i was at for what like four four and a half years basically the [Ed Purmalis]: place that where i grew up as a young adult was exactly what you’re describing the [Ed Purmalis]: People were [Ed Purmalis]: the people were only you know coin operated the management was only cared about [Ed Purmalis]: you if you were putting out results [Ed Purmalis]: there was micro management there was [Ed Purmalis]: it was not a nurturing environment by any means but least it was a sales [Ed Purmalis]: environment so everybody kind of knew what they were getting themselves into in [Ed Purmalis]: the sense [Nick McGowan]: sure [Ed Purmalis]: that you know hey you know you can you can do what you want as long as my pch [Ed Purmalis]: comes in time and it has this many zeros i’m good with it [Ed Purmalis]: So I’ve seen how that works and I’ve seen how detrimental it is to people’s mental [Ed Purmalis]: health including mine and what kind of person you come out working in that type of [Ed Purmalis]: environment [Ed Purmalis]: now the way that type of environment gets fostered from the beginning is really a [Ed Purmalis]: generational [Ed Purmalis]: issue and it’s been that way that’s been the sta it’s been the status quo for [Ed Purmalis]: the better part of the last two centuries uh [Ed Purmalis]: that you know the corporate environment works as a chain of screening structure [Ed Purmalis]: where the ceo is yelling at the v p the vps yelling at the manager and the manager [Ed Purmalis]: is yelling at their team because productivity arises from fear right i mean that’s [Ed Purmalis]: at least what was thought of as to be fact for the longest time in the world [Ed Purmalis]: so really it’s a problem of environment listen you put a good man between pigs and [Ed Purmalis]: he’s gonna be playing in the mud soon enough it’s just a fact and that’s how [Ed Purmalis]: corporate structures have been raised for forever and all of these [Ed Purmalis]: all of these old school companies had this issue from the get go now when startups [Ed Purmalis]: started appearing like tech startups you know that’s when they started you know [Ed Purmalis]: let’s s take a little bit more care of our people [Ed Purmalis]: Google gives you all these benefits blah blah blah but you know there was still a [Ed Purmalis]: managerial issue there right so now what we what we could call the business [Ed Purmalis]: environment of [Ed Purmalis]: the post pandemic business environment let’s just call it that when solo preneurs [Ed Purmalis]: and startups really took over and they become they became fully global and fully [Ed Purmalis]: remote this is what the revolution is happening like this is gonna be the status [Ed Purmalis]: quo ten years from now it’s gonna be all about nurture it’s gonna be all about [Ed Purmalis]: growth and it’s all going to be about the human element of the employee and this [Ed Purmalis]: isn’t me [Nick McGowan]: Of course [Ed Purmalis]: just pulling it out on my ass i talked i talked to a couple of people that are [Ed Purmalis]: advisors that are advising fortune five hundred companies currently how to pivot [Ed Purmalis]: to that state of management so this isn’t just something that i’ve made up i’ve [Ed Purmalis]: had a conversation with a couple of guys who are in those positions who are you [Ed Purmalis]: know also podcasters and they get hired by the most brutal companies you could [Ed Purmalis]: imagine to humanize the workplace so this movement [Nick McGowan]: six [Ed Purmalis]: is happening whether you like it or you not but this is a sink or swim moment for [Ed Purmalis]: a lot of these corporate structures that were old stale and soon enough they’re [Ed Purmalis]: gonna be nolan voy [Nick McGowan]: think of how [Ed Purmalis]: thank you logically advanced need become pa sixty [Nick McGowan]: technologically advanced we’ve become even in the past fifty sixty hundred years [Nick McGowan]: yet what you’re saying is more people focused and i’m right there with you i agree [Ed Purmalis]: I agree that it’s kind of like people going in and going hey can you just not be [Nick McGowan]: that it’s kind of like people going in going hey can you just not be an asshole of [Ed Purmalis]: an [Nick McGowan]: people and like think you know and be open like maybe [Ed Purmalis]: open like maybe [Nick McGowan]: and people were understanding yeah maybe i don’t have to be an asset the people [Ed Purmalis]: and people were understanding yeah maybe i don’t have to be an expert and i’m [Nick McGowan]: and i’m really just being an asso because i was pissed about this other thing that [Ed Purmalis]: really just being an asso because i was pissed about this other thing that i need [Nick McGowan]: I need to deal with but if we all deal with those things we’ll be kind of far [Ed Purmalis]: to deal with but we all deal with those things will be kind of far right so as we [Nick McGowan]: right so as we continue to grow tech wise and we integrate tech [Ed Purmalis]: continue to grow tech wise and we integrate tech [Nick McGowan]: it’ be [Ed Purmalis]: it’ll be interesting to see how we integrate tech to the human side [Nick McGowan]: interesting to see how we integrate tech but keep the human side and become more [Nick McGowan]: human because i think [Ed Purmalis]: I think [Nick McGowan]: we’re now actually tapping deeper into emotions and being able to balance those [Ed Purmalis]: deeper into emotions and being able to balance those questions um there’s still i [Nick McGowan]: emotions [Nick McGowan]: there’s still i have conversations with my dad where every once in a while like i [Ed Purmalis]: have conversations with my dad where every once in a while like i can just tell [Nick McGowan]: can just tell we’re at different stages of like he’s not going to get to this [Ed Purmalis]: we’re at different stages of like he’s not gonna get to this emotional stage just [Nick McGowan]: emotional stage just yet where I can kind of just jump there and be like hey we [Ed Purmalis]: yet where i can kind of just jump and be like hey we can be here for a minute [Nick McGowan]: can be here for a minute and that’s okay you know um and that might be a [Ed Purmalis]: that’s okay you know [Ed Purmalis]: and that might be a generational thing i’ve also told heard different things with [Nick McGowan]: generational thing i’ve also heard different things with [Nick McGowan]: generation z as a millennial i’ve heard that z or being more competitive yeah so [Ed Purmalis]: generation z as a millennial i’ve heard that be you be more competitive yeah so [Nick McGowan]: I’ve heard that they’re being more competitive which is very much a [Ed Purmalis]: i’ve heard that they’re being more competitive which is very much a [Nick McGowan]: I guess [Nick McGowan]: that’s like a boomer or i’m not going to go down that path and kind of go into all [Ed Purmalis]: i guess that’s like a boomer or i’m not going to go down that path and kind of go [Nick McGowan]: those different sections but to think about where we’re going technology wise and [Ed Purmalis]: going into all those different sections but to think about where we’re going [Ed Purmalis]: technology wise and how the humans are coming into that it’s interesting to hear [Nick McGowan]: how the humans are coming into that it’s interesting to hear from your perspective [Ed Purmalis]: from your perspective five children [Nick McGowan]: somebody who’s twenty five not much older only thirty seven but to see that [Ed Purmalis]: thirty seven but to see that difference and where you’re seeing things going [Nick McGowan]: difference and where you’re seeing things going [Nick McGowan]: how do you think [Ed Purmalis]: how do you think people can kind of help that along even within their day to day [Nick McGowan]: people can kind of help that along even within their day to day what kind of tips [Nick McGowan]: and tricks would you give them to be able to just keep keep going with that [Ed Purmalis]: what kind of tips and tricks did you give them to be able to just keep [Ed Purmalis]: yeah and i actually want to backtrack to your previous point about the technology [Ed Purmalis]: of having a role in this technology has also eliminate a lot of busy work which is [Ed Purmalis]: what usually puts people in those moods and the second thing is technology has [Ed Purmalis]: made everything reputation based if you’re an asshole in twenty twenty two people [Ed Purmalis]: are gonna find out like even even some big uh saas companies right now are being [Ed Purmalis]: exposed all over the internet for their behavior and it’s it’s you know this isn’t [Ed Purmalis]: something that would have happened thirty years ago they could have been running a [Ed Purmalis]: slave labor shop and nobody would find out [Ed Purmalis]: but to [Ed Purmalis]: to your point to your point [Ed Purmalis]: um [Ed Purmalis]: try being more compassionate is something that everybody needs to learn at some [Ed Purmalis]: point in their lives and the sooner you do it the better [Ed Purmalis]: the [Ed Purmalis]: for a lot of for a lot of gen z i guess growing up with [Ed Purmalis]: depression and anxiety which is you know it’s a millennial thing true but it’ also [Ed Purmalis]: it’s also a very deep gen z thing because make people a bit more compassionate [Ed Purmalis]: like like like like like k kids at fifteen are going to therapy which didn’t used [Ed Purmalis]: to really be a thing back then unless you were [Nick McGowan]: no [Ed Purmalis]: completely fucked up [Nick McGowan]: yeah [Ed Purmalis]: so [Ed Purmalis]: in that sense that’s already working its own magic but the way the way that [Ed Purmalis]: anybody who’s maybe around my age can go and join the revolution is you know first [Ed Purmalis]: option is you know once you once you go into a managerial role you set that [Ed Purmalis]: example and you follow it but that’s not always going to be possible because [Ed Purmalis]: you’re still [Ed Purmalis]: you are still [Ed Purmalis]: reporting to somebody [Ed Purmalis]: i’d say join the sop entrepreneurship wave and run the kind of that you would want [Ed Purmalis]: to work work in that’s that’s how you go when you do it and you know not [Ed Purmalis]: everybody’s going to be an entrepreneur but if you can be you should and you [Ed Purmalis]: should be having a tribe and people that you work with that that absolutely adore [Ed Purmalis]: you and that whose lives you make better and ultimately who you serve [Ed Purmalis]: and that’s how you joined the movement right that’s how you make it happen [Nick McGowan]: yeah and it sounds like you know if you do the thing that you feel like align with [Ed Purmalis]: yeah it sounds like you know if you do the thing that you feel like aligned with [Nick McGowan]: with you then do that thing the thing that makes the most sense and that’s the [Ed Purmalis]: with you then do that thing thing that makes the most sense that more offensive [Nick McGowan]: most authentic and some people are afraid to kind of let some of that out but man [Ed Purmalis]: are a braid to kind of let some of that out but ben i appreciate you getting into [Nick McGowan]: I appreciate you getting into a lot of stuff today i’ve got a couple more [Ed Purmalis]: a lot of stuff today i’m got a couple more questions i want to dig into and i know [Nick McGowan]: questions i want to dig into and i know we could just talk in for hours and hours [Ed Purmalis]: we could just talk in for hours and hours and hours but can you give us something [Nick McGowan]: and hours but can you give us something that you think is the most important thing [Ed Purmalis]: that you think is the most important thing you’ve learned in life that has really [Nick McGowan]: that you’ve learned in life that has really helped you change especially over the [Ed Purmalis]: helped you change especially [Nick McGowan]: past couple of years [Ed Purmalis]: most important well listen most important if i had to say [Ed Purmalis]: most important thing [Ed Purmalis]: what the most important thing is [Ed Purmalis]: the most important thing that i actually fairly recently really really started [Ed Purmalis]: adapting again [Ed Purmalis]: In what’s ultimately going to be the next [Ed Purmalis]: different [Ed Purmalis]: differentiator between where i am now and where i’m planning to be [Ed Purmalis]: is to focus [Ed Purmalis]: less [Ed Purmalis]: on [Ed Purmalis]: results and focus more on the process [Ed Purmalis]: because results can often come easy [Ed Purmalis]: or they can be very very hard hard fought the problem with easy results is that [Ed Purmalis]: then you can fall off your track and go into this yoyo of here i’m doing good here [Ed Purmalis]: i’m doing bad i’m doing good let’s celebrate [Nick McGowan]: let’s see [Ed Purmalis]: let’s do nothing let’s go back down and that’s how I start jumping around and [Ed Purmalis]: that’s because you’re focused on results and also results are sometimes just [Ed Purmalis]: something that you’re not in control of one hundred percent but the process is and [Ed Purmalis]: even if things don’t work out exactly as you wanted them to you’re gonna have a [Ed Purmalis]: much easier time falling asleep at night knowing that you did all the right moves [Ed Purmalis]: And all the right things [Nick McGowan]: beautiful trust the process and to my filly friends you’re welcome [Ed Purmalis]: beautiful trust the process my philly friends you’re welcome [Nick McGowan]: So then [Ed Purmalis]: so [Nick McGowan]: where can people find you where can they connect with you [Ed Purmalis]: ben where can people find you recom [Ed Purmalis]: do linkedin linkedin has everything else that i’m doing so [Nick McGowan]: cool [Ed Purmalis]: linkedin edward perms my name and my link is probably going to be in the shows so [Ed Purmalis]: no need to try to spell it out yourself [Ed Purmalis]: yeah and from there you can find bunch of more stuff about me and the things that [Ed Purmalis]: i’m doing and the podcast that i host and nick has also been a guest on my show we [Ed Purmalis]: had a pretty good conversation there so [Ed Purmalis]: uh yeah [Nick McGowan]: go ahead name drop that show [Ed Purmalis]: that’s that’s pretty much it [Ed Purmalis]: uh it’s the level up show where we are diving into people’s stories and figuring [Ed Purmalis]: out what got them to the place they are today [Nick McGowan]: that is beautiful well thank you for being on the show today my friend it’s [Ed Purmalis]: that is beautiful well thank you for being on the show today my friend it’s [Nick McGowan]: awesome to have you and i’m excited to be on your show again at some point and [Ed Purmalis]: awesome to have you and i’m excited to be on your show again at some point [Nick McGowan]: have you back here [Ed Purmalis]: sounds great man
