What Happens After An Out Of Body Experience? – Ep.64 – Kyle Lynch

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Episode summary:​ Kyle Lynch was always feeling lost and confused, about what we are, who we are, why we are here, and those deeper thoughts.

He sought out counseling and his therapist recommended an MDMA-guided, therapeutic session. Kyle researched MDMA and agreed, even though he had never done drugs before. 

His session felt great and it opened up his heart and mind. He knows now it’s okay to feel vulnerable. 

That was just the beginning of Kyle’s healing and spiritual journey. What changed his life the most was his out-of-body experience.

Guest Name & Bio: Author, painter, metaphysical product creator (labels), and fellow human. Kyle began a different way of viewing our existence here on earth after his first out-of-body experience. 

His new understanding gave him the courage to go back to school in his early 30’s to receive a bachelor’s degree in psychology and a master’s degree in mental health counseling. He loves yoga, paddle boarding, fantasy sports, and his corgi Cooper.

Kyle Lynch

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[Nick McGowan]: Kyle welcome to the show man

how you doing

[Kyle Lynch]: i mean that’s a load of question

we’ll get into it

[Nick McGowan]: uh

[Kyle Lynch]: honestly i have a little

[Nick McGowan]: uh

[Kyle Lynch]: bit of anxiety but thanks for having

me this is awesome ready to dive into

[Kyle Lynch]: this awesome conversation

[Nick McGowan]: yeah man i’m excited to have you

on while we were talking a little bit

[Nick McGowan]: about the anxiety four and there are

certain certain people that all hop on to

[Nick McGowan]: a conversation like this and they just

have a rough time with it at first

[Nick McGowan]: and then they get comfortable with it

and other people that are just comfortable being

[Nick McGowan]: on comfortable but part of the reason

why you’re on the show is to be

[Nick McGowan]: able to talk about stuff like that

you know to be able to go through

[Nick McGowan]: your mind set and really what you

do in your your coaching and all that

[Nick McGowan]: sort of stuff so hey i don’t

want to step on your toes and why

[Nick McGowan]: don’t you tell us what do you

do for living and what’s one thing that

[Nick McGowan]: most people don’t know about you that’s

maybe a little odd or bizarre

[Kyle Lynch]: all right so i’m actually in between

careers right now and this is part of

[Kyle Lynch]: my my path originally i went

[Nick McGowan]: h

[Kyle Lynch]: to school for audio

[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: engineering and i’ve been working

[Nick McGowan]: nice

[Kyle Lynch]: at a public rat o station for

a long time and it’s kind of like

[Kyle Lynch]: at this point it’s very mundane for

me it’s very robotic and

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: at some point in my life like

i need to do something else and my

[Kyle Lynch]: journey led me to mental health counseling

and there’s whole story behind that to which

[Kyle Lynch]: we could get into so right now

working in a private practice as a mental

[Kyle Lynch]: health councillor and still working at the

radio station help pay some bills s interesting

[Kyle Lynch]: kind of two different fields completely but


[Nick McGowan]: oh

[Kyle Lynch]: tell people that the correlation is i

have to listen to a lot of things

[Nick McGowan]: yeah yeah definitely makes sense what’s that

one thing that most people don’t know about

[Nick McGowan]: you

[Kyle Lynch]: um m well this is fairly new

and when i don’t feel comfortable with something

[Kyle Lynch]: myself with the knowledge of it or

the experience of it i don’t tell anyone

[Kyle Lynch]: about it but i’m starting to get

into tantra which is like it made for

[Kyle Lynch]: me it seems like a weird thing

because it’s like a different me coming out

[Kyle Lynch]: where

[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: it’s like acknowledging like oh i want

to explore this but it’s just like it’s

[Kyle Lynch]: a feels like an completely different me

um m so i haven’t really i haven’t

[Kyle Lynch]: told anyone about that except for one

person who i asked advice about like what

[Kyle Lynch]: should i read what should i like

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: the path in it it’s

[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: haven’t

[Nick McGowan]: typically a researcher

[Kyle Lynch]: yeah

[Nick McGowan]: like one

[Kyle Lynch]: i

[Nick McGowan]: of

[Kyle Lynch]: start

[Nick McGowan]: those people

[Kyle Lynch]: everything

[Nick McGowan]: that was just research

[Kyle Lynch]: reading i want to make

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: sure that my my mental plane aligned

with the experience before i jump in because

[Kyle Lynch]: i don’t want to be

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: like oh yeah i just want to

do a tontroit’slike why like what is it

[Kyle Lynch]: about

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: it that you want to do it

so like i’m just gonna learn about it

[Kyle Lynch]: so i read some osho books and

about the spirit the rooted spiritual aspects of

[Kyle Lynch]: it because i want

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: to take things seriously

[Nick McGowan]: that’s great to be able to

[Kyle Lynch]: oh

[Nick McGowan]: look at it from as close to

the core as you can

[Kyle Lynch]: oh

[Nick McGowan]: i know some people just with anything

will get get hitched on to some sort

[Nick McGowan]: of fad or whatever is exciting for

them and then they get rid of it

[Nick McGowan]: a couple o months later because it

it wasn’t something they actually sunk their teeth

[Nick McGowan]: into

[Kyle Lynch]: oh

[Nick McGowan]: are you kind

[Kyle Lynch]: it’s

[Nick McGowan]: of

[Kyle Lynch]: interesting

[Nick McGowan]: sinking

[Kyle Lynch]: that

[Nick McGowan]: your

[Kyle Lynch]: you

[Nick McGowan]: teeth

[Kyle Lynch]: mentioned

[Nick McGowan]: into

[Kyle Lynch]: core um

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: because i’ll say one more thing that

i really haven’t told anyone my therapist recommended

[Kyle Lynch]: me to someone that she met at

a meditation retreat to do m d m

[Kyle Lynch]: guided therapy and

[Nick McGowan]: nice

[Kyle Lynch]: m d m m it’s it’s a

heart opener and growing up

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: i was never i never did drugs

like i was pretty much a mamma’s boy

[Kyle Lynch]: very goody tissues but then there’s this

part of me that wants to explore things

[Kyle Lynch]: in a responsible way and so that

experience was amazing um which

[Nick McGowan]: wow

[Kyle Lynch]: made me wonder if that’s what i

want do as a councillor

[Nick McGowan]: i mean on one hand to be

able to say why give people drugs and

[Nick McGowan]: they experience immense joy and we figure

things out from there such a cool way

[Nick McGowan]: to be able to look at it

where in ten years ago fifteen years ago

[Nick McGowan]: do you make anything close to that

molly you know that sort of stuff remember

[Nick McGowan]: there’s stuff going around like oh it

puts holes in your brain and you don’t

[Nick McGowan]: want to be the zombi because you

did and you know whatever now it’s coming

[Nick McGowan]: out along with mushrooms and stuff like

that where people are using it in a

[Nick McGowan]: different way to be able to be

therapeutic how many times have you done that

[Kyle Lynch]: just once if it

[Nick McGowan]: what sort of dosage did they give


[Kyle Lynch]: i don’t know the exact dosage but

it was very i did so much research

[Kyle Lynch]: before i did it i wasn’t just

like oh yeah i’m goin to do this

[Nick McGowan]: m yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: so the guy

[Nick McGowan]: plop

[Kyle Lynch]: was awesome he gave me all

[Nick McGowan]: okay

[Kyle Lynch]: the information i needed this was maybe

like six years ago i want to say

[Nick McGowan]: okay

[Kyle Lynch]: it gave me like all vitamins before

it m oh the setting was super nice

[Kyle Lynch]: as comfortable went to his house in

upstate new york he told me to bring

[Kyle Lynch]: pictures of people who were important to

me family members so

[Nick McGowan]: it’s cool

[Kyle Lynch]: yeah definitely opens up your heart

[Nick McGowan]: what would you say was the biggest

thing you learned from that

[Kyle Lynch]: m m m

[Kyle Lynch]: that it’s okay to be vulnerable as

i feel like i told that guy some

[Kyle Lynch]: crazy stuff about myself that i didn’t

feel like i would ever tell anyone

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: um m when your heart is open

and you feel relaxed it’s like all right

[Kyle Lynch]: i feel like i could talk about

this stuff and m it’s tougher without the

[Kyle Lynch]: heart opener as then we start well

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: i start to feel like the anxiety

of things i feel the vibrations

[Nick McGowan]: sure

[Kyle Lynch]: in my body which has a physiological

effect on it um m there are so

[Kyle Lynch]: many benefits of being vulnerable not just

for oneself but for other people because

[Nick McGowan]: time

[Kyle Lynch]: yeah i see someone else be vulnerable

it’s just like i don’t fully understand how

[Kyle Lynch]: tough it is for them but i

respect it so much because oh now it’s

[Kyle Lynch]: got to be tough um

[Nick McGowan]: sure

[Kyle Lynch]: m then we feel i feel lighter

when someone else is horble

[Nick McGowan]: what do you

[Kyle Lynch]: m

[Nick McGowan]: think that is

[Kyle Lynch]: i believe it’s unseen energies affect us

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: so i feel like it’s kind of

like might be a terrible example but someone

[Kyle Lynch]: yawns and then you yawn or someone’s


[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: it’s like it’s contagious and it’s it’s

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: it’s like empathy it’s like picking up

other people’s stuff

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: and if someone feels lighter for releasing

stuff and we can feel lighter an i

[Kyle Lynch]: don’t know exactly what’s going on behind

the scenes but that’s just what i believe

[Kyle Lynch]: just the energies that are getting kind

of exchange between between everyone

[Nick McGowan]: it’s a good way to look

[Kyle Lynch]: m

[Nick McGowan]: at it do you think you could

feel that also through social media when somebody’s

[Nick McGowan]: expressing something or the opposite side of

that of somebody’s being you know basically a

[Nick McGowan]: bolt faced liar about something

[Kyle Lynch]: right i mean i’d never say no

to anything being possible yeah i feel like

[Kyle Lynch]: it’s more difficult for me it is

more difficult to pick up energies the web

[Kyle Lynch]: that’s not to

[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: say it’s not possible because i believe

anything is freak possible i believe we could

[Kyle Lynch]: start to think about someone who is

in a completely different country someone that we

[Kyle Lynch]: know and we could tap into their

feelings and i feel like a

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: we believe in something strongly than that

starts to manifest into our reality no matter

[Kyle Lynch]: what it is that’s going on for

us internally what we believe i believe that

[Kyle Lynch]: the universe unfolds external experience to match

what’s going on internally and if we fully

[Kyle Lynch]: believe something internally we just have to

watch it kind of play out

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: yeah

[Nick McGowan]: now as you’re kind of transitioning from

radio station into more of what you want

[Nick McGowan]: to do how do you how do

you kind of guide yourself through that with

[Nick McGowan]: what you were just saying

[Kyle Lynch]: oh i think it’s kind how do

i guide myself it’s still a challenge i

[Kyle Lynch]: mean it’s always a challenge

[Nick McGowan]: sure

[Kyle Lynch]: for me it’s a challenge to say

yes this is what i want and i’m

[Kyle Lynch]: going to go for it um m

yeah i feel like we have to have

[Kyle Lynch]: more experiences with what we want like

the mental health field like i went into

[Kyle Lynch]: it because it i have a friend

who is in the mental health field and

[Kyle Lynch]: i spoke to her about my outer

body experiences and i was trying to figure

[Kyle Lynch]: out a way how i could bring

my outer body experience and this new way

[Kyle Lynch]: of thinking about reality into a life

where professional life where it’s like all right

[Kyle Lynch]: i need a job i need to

live in this physical

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: world need to make some money but

how can i put this towards something that

[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: how can i put this out of

body experience in this knowledge towards a field

[Kyle Lynch]: that fits and so i spoke with

my friend who is a mental health councillor

[Kyle Lynch]: and she has like all the same

interests that i do and so many of

[Kyle Lynch]: the same beliefs mike all right i

could see myself doing that and this might

[Kyle Lynch]: be were but just like imagining myself

as an old man like

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: hopefully i get to be an old

man and if i do get there just

[Kyle Lynch]: like i just see myself at like

a meditation retreat being this old dude like

[Kyle Lynch]: some place tropical because i can’t see

myself at a radio station as an old

[Kyle Lynch]: man that seems depressing not that that

it’s a bad job just for me it

[Kyle Lynch]: doesn’t fit so and there was a

part of me with the social kind of

[Kyle Lynch]: expectations and the social pressure of i

need to get a degree like i got

[Kyle Lynch]: to keep on moving so it’s like

i had to go back to school to

[Kyle Lynch]: go bachelors and psychology and master is

a mental health counseling and i’m like i’m

[Kyle Lynch]: already in so much student loans like

this seems crazy but after my outer body

[Kyle Lynch]: experience i felt like that released a

lot of energy of fear around things

[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: where it’s like yes i still got

like anxious i fear about things because that

[Kyle Lynch]: out of body experience happened ten years

ago i want to say maybe a little

[Kyle Lynch]: longer but it created a mindset within

me that were more than just these bodies

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: so we can take risks in life

[Nick McGowan]: time so tell us a bit more

about the the out of body experience how

[Nick McGowan]: did that come about what did that

look like and what did you

[Kyle Lynch]: yeah

[Nick McGowan]: experience afterwards

[Kyle Lynch]: i just got chills just like thinking

about it that’s what happened during it so

[Kyle Lynch]: this is what i believe well i’ll

start in the beginning so it’s having an

[Kyle Lynch]: existential crisis trying to figure out my

path in life what do i want to

[Kyle Lynch]: do for work like what is this

that we live in who am i and

[Kyle Lynch]: i just like look in the mirror

and i’m like who like what is this

[Kyle Lynch]: who my like i went even very

logical and practical with the question of all

[Kyle Lynch]: right if i chop off my arm

then i’m still me so i’m not an

[Kyle Lynch]: arm i even wrote a book

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: that i didn’t publish but it helped

me kind of discover a more spiritual way

[Kyle Lynch]: of being so i dissected like all

the physical parts of ourselves like one by

[Kyle Lynch]: one it’s like art if i got

a heart transplant i’m still me so i’m

[Kyle Lynch]: not a heart

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: and even like all of our social

identities it’s like all right i call myself

[Kyle Lynch]: Kyle Lynch but i could legally change my

name so anything that’s like a label in

[Kyle Lynch]: our mind that’s not me either so

it’s like i’ve figured out all these s

[Kyle Lynch]: that we are not

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: and during this time like i was

crying like it’s like two weeks straight just

[Kyle Lynch]: like letting it out just being so

lost and confused and during this time i

[Kyle Lynch]: decided to start like reading about meditation

and the brain um m so i learned

[Kyle Lynch]: about meditating while in dream state so

it’s to be in dream yoga and that’s

[Kyle Lynch]: supposed to be like a super profound

experience to be able to meditate while you’re

[Kyle Lynch]: dreaming so you’re aware that you’re dreaming

like i’m going to meditate so during this

[Kyle Lynch]: two weeks span of just like balling

my eyes out and feeling completely lost started

[Kyle Lynch]: like i feel like my questions of

who was i was answered by having the

[Kyle Lynch]: outer body experience um so i was

falling asleep one night in my bed and

[Kyle Lynch]: i felt this presence on top of

me like it felt like some sort of

[Kyle Lynch]: demon like i was in a hypnogogic

state of falling asleep and waking up and

[Kyle Lynch]: during this state i thought about what

i read about meditating while dreaming like all

[Kyle Lynch]: right

[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: i have this in the back of

my mind i’m aware that i’m in the

[Kyle Lynch]: hypnogogic state i feel this energy presence

on me and it feels like it’s sucking

[Kyle Lynch]: energy out of me but rather than

like in freaked out i just stayed m

[Kyle Lynch]: and while i was staying com and

meditate in that state i started to hear

[Kyle Lynch]: like loud washing sound and i started

to hear vibrations and field vibrations and then

[Kyle Lynch]: just popped out of my body and

i felt myself floating around the ceiling of

[Kyle Lynch]: my room and all i could see

i saw my body and i saw like

[Kyle Lynch]: a red laser bouncing around everywhere and

only after i came back to my body

[Kyle Lynch]: did i realize it was the red

l d on my t v when the

[Kyle Lynch]: t v is off it has red

light and so

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: that was like the only light in

my room at the time but while i

[Kyle Lynch]: was out of my body i heard

those voices like the super deep voice m

[Kyle Lynch]: and it said that i was an

important leader and i was wondering if this

[Kyle Lynch]: was my in my past life he

was referring to and i was aware of

[Kyle Lynch]: the experience i was having and i

asked myself in my mind like do i

[Kyle Lynch]: want to meditate while in this state

or do i want to figure out who

[Kyle Lynch]: this being is that i’m hearing so

i just i’m like i’m not going down

[Kyle Lynch]: to rabbit hole any further because this

is my first experience of being out of

[Kyle Lynch]: my body so i’m not going to

meditate so i ask the being i try

[Kyle Lynch]: to ask who are you and when

i try to ask that i think my

[Kyle Lynch]: mind thought of my physical mouth like

physically speaking and so that’s

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: when i fell back into my body

because i feel like my mind got attached

[Kyle Lynch]: to my body again with the idea

of speak i

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: and then i had chills i freaked

out like turned on all the way like

[Kyle Lynch]: what the hell was that

[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: and

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: the next day i looked up all

the symptoms of like the vibration the swishing

[Kyle Lynch]: sound found so many people like oh

yeah it’s ashe projecting i’m like that’s freaking

[Kyle Lynch]: real like

[Nick McGowan]: and now you know

[Kyle Lynch]: that’s real and so then after that

like my mind set about so many things

[Kyle Lynch]: in life changed completely oh

[Nick McGowan]: m before we go any further with

that i want to point out that you

[Nick McGowan]: said before that you were goody two

shoes and you hadn’t done any drugs because

[Nick McGowan]: go to assume that a lot of

the audience has at least tested out some

[Nick McGowan]: drugs over the course of

[Kyle Lynch]: oh

[Nick McGowan]: high school or something like that and

even with some of the wildest ship that

[Nick McGowan]: you try or just pump a bunch

of things

[Kyle Lynch]: oh

[Nick McGowan]: into your system when you younger you

don’t typically get to that sort of experience

[Nick McGowan]: there are times where you can trip

and you can feel things and feel like

[Nick McGowan]: you’re outside of yourself sort of but

the astral projection is a completely different thing

[Nick McGowan]: i don’t think i’ve ever actually experienced

that i’ve experienced more of the i’m real

[Nick McGowan]: fucked up and tripping and i see

things outside of me

[Kyle Lynch]: okay

[Nick McGowan]: but never the

[Kyle Lynch]: oh

[Nick McGowan]: actual astral projection so i couldn’t i

can’t understand exactly what that feels like from

[Nick McGowan]: your perspective but i can understand the

thought of like holy ship this is real

[Kyle Lynch]: yep

[Nick McGowan]: this is what can happen so in

that moment the next day when you’re reading

[Nick McGowan]: through this is what actually happened what

started to shift in your mind at that

[Nick McGowan]: point

[Kyle Lynch]: oh um m i think it gave

me more questions it actually it excited

[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: me too because i felt like i

had a passionate direction to go in something

[Kyle Lynch]: that like was firm i don’t know

if that’s the right word but something that

[Kyle Lynch]: i was so sure about because i


[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: it and it wasn’t a mundane experience

where i feel like i would judge my

[Kyle Lynch]: life and other people’s lives of not

questioning reality and we’re just like going through

[Kyle Lynch]: emotions so this was exciting for me

that this was completely due to me and

[Kyle Lynch]: it seems like it’s completely new to

every one that’s in my life so it

[Kyle Lynch]: is like more exciting and interesting but

again like it helped me release fear and

[Kyle Lynch]: helped me take risks

[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: but i also didn’t know what to

do with this information that i have like

[Kyle Lynch]: all right

[Nick McGowan]: sure

[Kyle Lynch]: alreaght i’m not my body what the

hell do i do with this information and

[Nick McGowan]: and

[Kyle Lynch]: i

[Nick McGowan]: now

[Kyle Lynch]: still

[Nick McGowan]: what

[Kyle Lynch]: don’t fully know other then let’s explore

it try to have fun with it

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: and i the ability to do that

i started to own it a little bit

[Kyle Lynch]: more just because since i was able

to tell myself that this is real i

[Kyle Lynch]: had to ex and now we can

improve on it so i started to learn

[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: the skills of more lucid dreaming because

we’re able

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: to get out of our bodies through

lois dreaming as well

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: i took a couple of courses on

ational projecting but i feel like we do

[Kyle Lynch]: have to be in some sort of

like open state and i feel like

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: i was having my existential breakdown and

crying all the time like i was just

[Kyle Lynch]: like open and like releasing so much

stuff that i feel like

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: i was able to leave my body

more where it’s like now i feel like

[Kyle Lynch]: i put more crap inside of me


[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: with certain mind sets and beliefs that


[Nick McGowan]: sure

[Kyle Lynch]: feel more weighed down inside so it’s

more difficult to even have the ash projecting

[Kyle Lynch]: experiences

[Nick McGowan]: a good point

[Kyle Lynch]: but just having that awareness it’s like

all right what do we have to release

[Kyle Lynch]: now to be able to have more

of these experiences

[Nick McGowan]: and that awareness is key

[Kyle Lynch]: oh

[Nick McGowan]: get into this often but if you’re

not aware you can’t know what the fun

[Nick McGowan]: to do next because you’re not aware

of the thing that’s happening or what’s in

[Nick McGowan]: front of you so even when you

became aware of the astro projecting and then

[Nick McGowan]: for you to take that next step

and go okay cool but what do i

[Nick McGowan]: do with this how do i do

something with it and being able to start

[Nick McGowan]: working on that what sort of what’s

the water down version that you can give

[Nick McGowan]: of like some sort of things that

you can do to be able to get

[Nick McGowan]: yourself into a lucid state and to

be able to actually step into your dream

[Nick McGowan]: and walk around a bit

[Kyle Lynch]: yah um practice learning the skills i

feel like we haven’t had an experience yet

[Kyle Lynch]: and i don’t mean to speak for

everyone i’m just speaking for myself and just

[Kyle Lynch]: i feel like for humans if we

haven’t had experience yet it’s hard to believe

[Kyle Lynch]: that it could happen and if

[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: we don’t believe it then we’re blocking

ourselves right away so even if

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: we’re practicing the techniques to leave our

body if we still have that in our

[Kyle Lynch]: mind of this is this real like

i’m doing the steps i’m

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: trying to practice but we have that

wall that we create so to get rid

[Kyle Lynch]: of that wall

[Kyle Lynch]: for me i think i was just

having that emotional release of crying all the

[Kyle Lynch]: time wanting answers so it’s like i

feel like i sent that out to the

[Kyle Lynch]: universe like i really need answers for

some things

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: right now and i feel like that

was given to me

[Nick McGowan]: gotta so with a wit

[Kyle Lynch]: yeah

[Nick McGowan]: with that you said that was about

ten years ago right

[Kyle Lynch]: yeah i’m terrible dates and time but

yeah i think

[Nick McGowan]: whatever

[Kyle Lynch]: it’s about

[Nick McGowan]: it

[Kyle Lynch]: ten

[Nick McGowan]: was

[Kyle Lynch]: years

[Nick McGowan]: a chunk

[Kyle Lynch]: ago

[Nick McGowan]: of time ago yeah it

[Kyle Lynch]: it was a shock

[Nick McGowan]: you

[Kyle Lynch]: of

[Nick McGowan]: don’t

[Kyle Lynch]: time

[Nick McGowan]: have to give like it was september

nineteenth of whatever but knowing that it was

[Nick McGowan]: about ten years ago and here you

are in your transition into what you’re what

[Nick McGowan]: you’re doing and kind of going from

the radio station deeper into the mental health

[Nick McGowan]: stuff but what did that look like

actually stepping into going back to school specifically

[Nick McGowan]: for mental health and just diving deep

into that what did that transition look like

[Kyle Lynch]: that was a tough transition but it

was exciting at the same time and actually

[Kyle Lynch]: my outer body experience was probably more

like six or seven years ago now that

[Kyle Lynch]: i’m doing the map on my head

because to go into a university setting with

[Kyle Lynch]: this spiritual mind set um m like

this is going to be tough to not

[Kyle Lynch]: like want to talk about this stuff

but i know

[Nick McGowan]: sure

[Kyle Lynch]: like certain universities are gonna be like

what the hell you’re talking about like we

[Nick McGowan]: yes

[Kyle Lynch]: can’t measure this um m i had

to fulfill that other means by talking to

[Kyle Lynch]: other like mystics and people who would

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: understand this ah but i’ve i was

really focused on doing well in school because

[Kyle Lynch]: i felt like i found a path

for myself um

[Nick McGowan]: true

[Kyle Lynch]: so i was determined during this time

when i went back from a bachelors in

[Kyle Lynch]: psychology i still dabbled i had my

first experience with a waska um m i

[Kyle Lynch]: i dont know f you want me

get into the ioaskexperience

[Nick McGowan]: please do yeah yeah that’s a thing

that most people won’t touch because i think

[Nick McGowan]: it freaks them out like the process

and how much ship comes out of it

[Nick McGowan]: and i think there’s a deep fear

with some people where they’re like i don’t

[Nick McGowan]: want to fix my problems because they’ve

been part of me for so long so

[Nick McGowan]: i always appreciate hearing from somebody that’s

gone path and did it please

[Kyle Lynch]: yeh

[Nick McGowan]: dive in

[Kyle Lynch]: and i because i have a friend

who went to peru and he became a

[Kyle Lynch]: shaman and then he

[Nick McGowan]: oh

[Kyle Lynch]: was living in brooklyn at the time

it’s like hey i’ll do a ceremony in

[Kyle Lynch]: my apartment i like all right like

i feel comfortable with you because

[Nick McGowan]: that’s

[Kyle Lynch]: i

[Nick McGowan]: cool

[Kyle Lynch]: wasn’t about to like go on this

like big retreat some place far away

[Nick McGowan]: go

[Kyle Lynch]: like

[Nick McGowan]: to

[Kyle Lynch]: i

[Nick McGowan]: peru

[Kyle Lynch]: was in school yeah and so i

had the whole ceremony

[Nick McGowan]: oh

[Kyle Lynch]: and i had to do like a

crazy diet

[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: for a long time like very bland

and i’m just like i’m doing this because

[Kyle Lynch]: i feel like oh this will be

fun i’ll be interesting like i want have

[Kyle Lynch]: different experiences to kind of understand myself

better to understand a reality like now that

[Kyle Lynch]: i

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: have this mind of from my outer

body experience i’m like i’m open to like

[Kyle Lynch]: so many different experiences and so my

experience with waska wasn’t like super intense because

[Kyle Lynch]: i set the intention i don’t want

this to be super intense like just show

[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: me what i need to show what

i need to see and i haven’t had

[Kyle Lynch]: any like visions like you had what

you talked about my experience with owasco was

[Kyle Lynch]: i’d be talking to myself and i’d

put myself in a hypothetical situation and not

[Kyle Lynch]: to say this is what would do

in this situation and if i was lying

[Kyle Lynch]: to myself then that’s when i would

feel like i’d throw up so

[Nick McGowan]: oh

[Kyle Lynch]: that’s what i got from the experience

of just like i lie to myself a

[Kyle Lynch]: lot and

[Nick McGowan]: oh

[Kyle Lynch]: we got to get rid of that

i didn’t

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: have any visions and then like but

i knew this already i’m like all right

[Kyle Lynch]: yeah i lied to myself about a

lot of things but yeah i ask just

[Kyle Lynch]: showed me a different way

[Nick McGowan]: sure especially if you if you if

you start to gag and almost throw up

[Nick McGowan]: when you’re lying like imagine if that

happened in real life even if you were

[Nick McGowan]: just to lie about something stupid like

did you move

[Kyle Lynch]: i

[Nick McGowan]: that

[Kyle Lynch]: should

[Nick McGowan]: thing no

[Kyle Lynch]: oh

[Nick McGowan]: sorry yes i moved it i’m sorry


[Kyle Lynch]: h

[Nick McGowan]: like if that was just like a

gag reflex

[Kyle Lynch]: h

[Nick McGowan]: you know

[Kyle Lynch]: it’s like

[Nick McGowan]: so

[Kyle Lynch]: what’s it stand from south park whenever

you saw wendy pia seen

[Nick McGowan]: yet

[Kyle Lynch]: south park

[Nick McGowan]: fly

[Kyle Lynch]: side that would be funny though

[Nick McGowan]: uh yeah well at least that didn’t

happen you know like that wasn’t

[Kyle Lynch]: i threw

[Nick McGowan]: a thing

[Kyle Lynch]: up

[Nick McGowan]: that stuck with you well i’m saying

it didn’t stick

[Kyle Lynch]: oh

[Nick McGowan]: with you like not every time

[Kyle Lynch]: oh

[Nick McGowan]: you’re about to make like a little

white lie or something you just bombed all

[Nick McGowan]: over people um

[Kyle Lynch]: yeah

[Nick McGowan]: but that’s a that’s an interesting thing

where it starts like it’s a physiological thing

[Nick McGowan]: it pushes on you like you’re

[Kyle Lynch]: yep

[Nick McGowan]: you’re lying and it starts to constrict

you so do you know feel that as

[Nick McGowan]: you kind of move through life after

that experience

[Kyle Lynch]: oh yeah i always i mean i

know what i lie about in my life

[Kyle Lynch]: whether it’s myself or someone else and

i feel like

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: i’m more sensitive than i have been

in the hath passed on emotional and energetic

[Kyle Lynch]: level because i took

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: on a vegetarian diet doing all the

mental health work and just like really focusing

[Kyle Lynch]: on what my inner world is i


[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: because made me very sensitive um m

so if i feel like there’s something in

[Kyle Lynch]: my life that i’m not dealing with

like i feel the weight of it sure

[Kyle Lynch]: all humans do like they feel on

certain parts of their body whether

[Nick McGowan]: sure

[Kyle Lynch]: it’s a chest or yeah but the

younger men would be able to just be

[Kyle Lynch]: like a brush off to the side

like whatever

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: but now i feel like i’m more

conscious about what’s what’s going on for me

[Kyle Lynch]: inwardly and this idea

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: of like looking inside

[Kyle Lynch]: i had a psychic friend i forget

how the conversation went but she told me

[Kyle Lynch]: to look inside and this is the

first time i’m just like what does that

[Kyle Lynch]: even mean like what does that mean

to look inside

[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: like what my guts like what the

[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: hell

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: does that to look inside and i

think asking that question having the curiosity and

[Kyle Lynch]: intention universe shows

[Nick McGowan]: yep

[Kyle Lynch]: you what it is

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: so i feel like our intention and

what we want to explore have to be

[Kyle Lynch]: mindful of because

[Nick McGowan]: big time yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: yeah

[Nick McGowan]: that’s a great way to think about

it too especially if a silly thing like

[Nick McGowan]: i think of somebody being like hey

go into the cabinet and grab the salt

[Nick McGowan]: and pepper like fucking i don’t want

to do that and you get up an

[Nick McGowan]: you’re like i don’t see it it’s

not in here like whatever i just i

[Nick McGowan]: don’t know and they walk up and

just right past you and just grab it

[Nick McGowan]: right in front of you like it

was right there right front of you you

[Nick McGowan]: just didn’t want to see it lot

of people will and to look at things

[Nick McGowan]: where they don’t want to see

[Kyle Lynch]: oh

[Nick McGowan]: things and just kind of push them

off but as you start to stretch that

[Nick McGowan]: muscle the awareness muscle specially

[Kyle Lynch]: yeah

[Nick McGowan]: you start to become deeper and deeper

and you feel the responsibility

[Kyle Lynch]: yeah

[Nick McGowan]: right like to be ble

[Kyle Lynch]: yeah

[Nick McGowan]: to do something with it because it’s

there you’re like well

[Kyle Lynch]: oh

[Nick McGowan]: i can’t just completely push you the

funk off so why don’t i do something

[Nick McGowan]: about it so what does that look

like with all the schooling that you’ve done

[Nick McGowan]: getting deeper into mental health now looking

back at that what does that look like

[Nick McGowan]: for you to be able to actually

set some of what you’ve learned into your

[Nick McGowan]: day to make sure that your mental

health is that at least the best shape

[Nick McGowan]: that it can be each day

[Kyle Lynch]: yeah i have a like in’t know

if love hate relationship with mental health is

[Kyle Lynch]: the right thing because there’s a part

of me that’s just like all right mental

[Kyle Lynch]: health if we put our energy and

focus on it then we’re going to get

[Kyle Lynch]: more of that so if we say

oh we have mental health issues like if

[Kyle Lynch]: we focus on that

[Nick McGowan]: get

[Kyle Lynch]: then

[Nick McGowan]: more

[Kyle Lynch]: we’re going to get more of that

so it’s like i have

[Nick McGowan]: sure

[Kyle Lynch]: that belief to a certain extent like

the law of attraction in a way

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: yeah yeah yeah but then i also

appreciate the idea of like helping someone if

[Kyle Lynch]: they’re going through stuff um

[Nick McGowan]: sure

[Kyle Lynch]: m so my relationship mental health is

it’s tough because it’s it’s all we want

[Kyle Lynch]: to get out of the head so

we want to get in our bodies because

[Kyle Lynch]: i see a lot of lot of

my clients like everyone stays in their head

[Kyle Lynch]: because we don’t even know what that

means to be in certain parts of our

[Kyle Lynch]: body and i

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: feel like i’m still kind of learning

that as well and i think it’s just

[Kyle Lynch]: about

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: putting awareness in certain it’s for a

body and just speaking sea

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: comes out so it’s like i’ll feel

into my stomach right now and see what

[Kyle Lynch]: comes out fail into my heart right

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: now and we’ll see what comes out

um it’s like different parts of our being

[Kyle Lynch]: speaking

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: but i try to do all the

normal things you you’d hear it’s like i

[Kyle Lynch]: try to go and nature i do

yoga breathing exercises

[Kyle Lynch]: how do else a journal but

[Nick McGowan]: you

[Kyle Lynch]: then it’s

[Nick McGowan]: all

[Kyle Lynch]: like

[Nick McGowan]: the standards

[Kyle Lynch]: life still put bring situations to you

so it is like is this

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: a infinite unfolding experience of like i’m

working on something so don’t we need ship

[Kyle Lynch]: to happen in our lives to

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: work on

[Nick McGowan]: test

[Kyle Lynch]: something

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: so it’s

[Nick McGowan]: exactly

[Kyle Lynch]: like do i want to have this


[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: and so that’s where it’s

[Nick McGowan]: i

[Kyle Lynch]: like it’s a love hate relationship with

mental health

[Nick McGowan]: i totally understand that man yeah i

get that too i had a conversation with

[Nick McGowan]: a client recently where i was telling

him i have to be mindful of my

[Nick McGowan]: face at different times with certain experiences

because i see a moment happening and i

[Nick McGowan]: almost just get maniacally happy about it

where i’m like oh fuck this is one

[Nick McGowan]: of those moments this is where we

get do something like this is that learning

[Nick McGowan]: moment but sometimes it could be i

could just look like me being a crazy

[Nick McGowan]: fucking guy just like standing there like


[Kyle Lynch]: oh

[Nick McGowan]: because i know it’s some deep ship

[Kyle Lynch]: ah

[Nick McGowan]: that you’re about to get into um

so when you think of the stuff that

[Nick McGowan]: you’ve learned and you’ve gone through and

you’ve gone through the schooling and you’re helping

[Nick McGowan]: clients and all of that know different

things resonate with different people like some people

[Nick McGowan]: their jam is is journaling or you

know walking out in nature and hiking and

[Nick McGowan]: all that sort of stuff what have

you found to really work with you

[Kyle Lynch]: um m it’s hard to say because

i try to take a person centered approach

[Kyle Lynch]: but at the same time there is

this spiritual part of me that says like

[Kyle Lynch]: oh this person that’s across to me

is a reflection of something that’s internally of

[Kyle Lynch]: me because i believe everything that exist

is connected we’re all reflections of each other

[Kyle Lynch]: so it’s like what do i need

to work on within myself to help this

[Kyle Lynch]: person i mean ultimately i just like

to point people to themselves a lot it’s

[Kyle Lynch]: like i feel like people start talking

about like other people and just like it

[Kyle Lynch]: becomes like feels very external almost like


[Nick McGowan]: and you’re like come

[Kyle Lynch]: it

[Nick McGowan]: on

[Kyle Lynch]: back

[Nick McGowan]: back

[Kyle Lynch]: to your body so i feel like

i have more like a somatic person centered

[Kyle Lynch]: approach where i want people to find

stillness and sometimes i got to check myself

[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: because it’s like i want people to

kind of wonder about life the same way

[Kyle Lynch]: that i do wonder about who they

are internally and have like a very spiritual

[Kyle Lynch]: kind of metaphysical way of viewing things

so that’s what i have to kind of

[Kyle Lynch]: check with myself where it’s like some

people just don’t want to go there so

[Kyle Lynch]: sometimes they just want to work on

their relation ship with her dad and

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: learned communication skills and that sort of


[Nick McGowan]: and

[Kyle Lynch]: and

[Nick McGowan]: you got to be okay with just

loving them where they’re at basically

[Kyle Lynch]: yeah

[Nick McGowan]: without

[Kyle Lynch]: but then

[Nick McGowan]: being like

[Kyle Lynch]: sometimes

[Nick McGowan]: why

[Kyle Lynch]: i get some

[Nick McGowan]: but why

[Kyle Lynch]: clients

[Nick McGowan]: not

[Kyle Lynch]: some clients right down their goals of

what they want to do someone says like

[Kyle Lynch]: i want to know myself i want

to know who i am i’m like yes

[Kyle Lynch]: i’m like i feel like we could

get like really deep with that and

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: i don’t know what part of me

likes those questions i don’t know it’s like

[Kyle Lynch]: soul my mind but it’s like that

lightens me up that excites me and

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: maybe that’s something for me too maybe

just because that person is a reflection what

[Kyle Lynch]: inside of me because

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: i’m always curious about who the hell

we are what are we doing here

[Nick McGowan]: i get that that’s cool especially to

be able to think about that reflection and

[Nick McGowan]: to be mindful of that

[Kyle Lynch]: yes

[Nick McGowan]: we can often forget about the reflection

or the reflective piece there have been times

[Nick McGowan]: for myself where i judge somebody about

something like i’ll see them and i’ll judge

[Nick McGowan]: them with something ll go why the

car you judging like because that’s a meat

[Nick McGowan]: problem

[Kyle Lynch]: yep

[Nick McGowan]: something that i have to work on

and just being consciously aware that so i

[Nick McGowan]: on to appreciate that reminder and i

appreciate that you actually look at that and

[Nick McGowan]: you’re mindful of that too it sounds

like and tell me if i’m wrong but

[Nick McGowan]: it sounds like there could be times

where you’re almost hyper aware of certain things

[Nick McGowan]: where you have to kind of pull

yourself back or try to find some balance

[Nick McGowan]: is that right

[Kyle Lynch]: i have no idea to be honest

with you

[Kyle Lynch]: i i don’t know what a like

what do you mean hyper war just like

[Kyle Lynch]: emotionally because i don’t want to say

like oh yeah like like i i know

[Kyle Lynch]: everything that like someone’s going through excited

i don’t or maybe i’d like to think

[Kyle Lynch]: i do but i don’t know a

hundred percent shore because i’m not them

[Nick McGowan]: sure

[Kyle Lynch]: but this just came to my mind

just like my my intention during my my

[Kyle Lynch]: existential breakdown where i was crying a

lot and asking questions

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: i remember i was driving one day

and i was listening to one of my

[Kyle Lynch]: favorite songs that really excites me like

it gives me chills when listen to it

[Kyle Lynch]: and during it like i set the

intention out to the universe i’m like i

[Kyle Lynch]: want to be this like super powerful

path and psychic like without this is before

[Kyle Lynch]: my outer body experience so it’s like

i didn’t have any knowledge of energy metaphysical

[Kyle Lynch]: like doing this type

[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: of stuff so it’s like i thought

i’m just like playing around like but i

[Kyle Lynch]: feel like

[Nick McGowan]: you’re just yelling in your car

[Kyle Lynch]: yeah but i feel like since i

was in such a heightened state within myself

[Kyle Lynch]: because i was listening to that song

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: like really happy and i put that

into the universe i feel like it came

[Kyle Lynch]: back to me somewhat because i feel

like i’m always changing because i don’t you

[Kyle Lynch]: asked ten years ago that i would

be doing this like i speak speaking with

[Kyle Lynch]: you be a mental heath councilor i’m

like i don’t see that at all like

[Kyle Lynch]: how does

[Nick McGowan]: how would

[Kyle Lynch]: so

[Nick McGowan]: i get there yah

[Kyle Lynch]: yeah don’t know if that makes

[Nick McGowan]: it’s

[Kyle Lynch]: any

[Nick McGowan]: interesting

[Kyle Lynch]: sense then but yeah

[Nick McGowan]: yeah yeah i get that and i

can appreciate that what i was talking about

[Nick McGowan]: was being

[Kyle Lynch]: yeah

[Nick McGowan]: hyper aware of certain things that you

do then the awareness of that where you

[Nick McGowan]: can kind of get stuck in like

oh well i’m looking at this person as

[Nick McGowan]: a mirror so what’s going on with

me instead of being there with the other

[Nick McGowan]: person and being present in and balance

within that now where you learn certain things

[Nick McGowan]: but then you go right well i

have to just adopt them and just have

[Nick McGowan]: them as part of me you find

that you’ve gotten to a point where you

[Nick McGowan]: have you have more of that happening

where things are just kind of absorbed into

[Nick McGowan]: your body and now just they’ve been

come who you are

[Kyle Lynch]: um m i believe to a certain

extent so i’ve been i don’t know how

[Kyle Lynch]: much of other people i pick up

[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: um but i’ve been told by people

who are close to me like whenever you

[Kyle Lynch]: hang out with this person you come

back just like them and with like whoever

[Kyle Lynch]: i’m with whether family men our other

friends it’s like i’ve been told like you

[Kyle Lynch]: almost become them so i don’t know

if i’m just like unconsciously picking up their

[Kyle Lynch]: energy and then an expressive of that

and i don’t know if that has to

[Kyle Lynch]: do with i said before about my

intention of wanting to become like superampathic but

[Nick McGowan]: h

[Kyle Lynch]: i

[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: i don’t want

[Nick McGowan]: m

[Kyle Lynch]: to say like yes or no because

i honestly i don’t know because then i

[Kyle Lynch]: would have to be that person completely

[Nick McGowan]: sure

[Kyle Lynch]: to say like yes i feel like

hyper vigilant that i’m

[Nick McGowan]: ye

[Kyle Lynch]: picking up things i don’t know

[Nick McGowan]: sure

[Kyle Lynch]: if that makes

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: sense

[Nick McGowan]: it might be the path yeah you

know you can kind of sponge things in

[Nick McGowan]: il it’s been awesome to have you

on i appreciate you getting in everything you’ve

[Nick McGowan]: gotten into and i appreciate the story

and what you’re what your journeys looked like

[Nick McGowan]: so far so thank you for being

on the show with us before we start

[Nick McGowan]: to wrap things up i always like

to ask what’s that one piece of advice

[Nick McGowan]: you’d give to the audience that’s on

their path towards self mastery

[Kyle Lynch]: yeah um show up when we’re talking

about this this

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: m whatever the thing is you want

to do it’s like don’t worry about making

[Kyle Lynch]: it perfect um m try not to

plan it out in your head just like

[Kyle Lynch]: start doing it and sometimes we i

don’t like the word failure but it just

[Kyle Lynch]: like

[Kyle Lynch]: creates another step for us every time

we have an experience

[Nick McGowan]: yeah

[Kyle Lynch]: it’s another step so it’s like for

me even doing this it’s just like this

[Kyle Lynch]: is a step and it’s like we

got to keep on going so just keep

[Kyle Lynch]: on showing up

[Nick McGowan]: hm

[Kyle Lynch]: trying our best we’re all on this

roller coaster of life together

[Nick McGowan]: hm good stuff Kyle Lynch and thank you

for showing up today man i appreciate your

[Nick McGowan]: time

[Kyle Lynch]: yeah

[Nick McGowan]: where can

[Kyle Lynch]: thank you

[Nick McGowan]: people

[Kyle Lynch]: nic

[Nick McGowan]: find you and where can they connect

with you

[Kyle Lynch]: um i have a website it’s a

k l energy portal dot com um have

[Kyle Lynch]: some services there i have some products

so they could check it out

[Nick McGowan]: perfect and all that stuff will be

in the show notes too so again

[Kyle Lynch]: yah

[Nick McGowan]: thank you so much i appreciate your


[Kyle Lynch]: thanks Nick good speaking with you

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